I need a little advice. I've decided i'm ready to follow the wiccan path.
A very good friend of mine is a Solitary Wiccan but has just started her own coven. Ever since i met her, she been telling me about the craft ( i think i've mentioned this before).

Anyway, she tells me i'm not ready to perform spells and i haven't done any yet as i'm scared of doing something wrong so shes right, im not ready, but i was wondering would anyone tell me , when working and learning on your own, how do you know when you are ready to perform a spell or ritual??

Also, when I want talk to the gods, can you do it anywhere, wherever you are, or do you have to do it at your alter in a circle?? and if a circle is needed would a visual one be good enough or does it have to be cast using tools?

See with all these questions, theres noo way im ready.

Any help, as always is very much appricated

bright blessings,

mystical moon

Mystical Moon,

I can so relate to how you are feeling, as I have felt like that once upon a time when working alone so to speak. I've grown through books & things picked up from here, & although the first time you try anything can seem so daunting, you will know. Needless to say I grew over a long time, but have never felt rushed. The advice your good friend has given you is interesting....., who is there to advise any solitary witch when they are ready, or not.?

Blessings, BC

Well this is it. Ok so i'm proberly not ready, but i feel like i am, so maybe she's just saving me from myself telling me i'm not. But then sometimes i kinda feeling like i'm waiting for someone to say ok your ready now.

She's invited me to join her coven, i think i'd like to join it, just for the confidence sorta thing, so i'd have to talk to her about this. I'd really like to join in with a ritual for samhain, so maybe i could do that instead of doing a ritual myself.

Thank you for your comment black cat, nice to know someone else went though the same thing as me.

My thoughts exactly, how does she know you are not ready only you will know when you are ready. A simple ritual can be lighting a candle for someone and meditating or praying for example.

Why don't you start by exploring the elements, really get to know each one in turn, see it, feel it , smell it, learn to visualise it, meditate on it.

Practice meditating, grounding, visualisation and protection all useful tools which you will need for spells and circle casting.

You can speak to the Gods/Goddesses anywhere, some people like to set up an altar for various reasons including a point of focus. Maybe go outside and really try to connect to nature, look up and the sun (not directly) or moon and just have a chat.

Hope that helps.

Ok, sorry i don't understand whats the difference between praying and performing a spell?

Well when I pray and not in the Christian sense I sit quietly and generally speak to God/Goddess ask for advice or for them to look out for someone or whatever comes to mind.

Spells are using energies to an end, building them up and focusing them into an object or just focusing and then releasing them with an intent.

Does that make sense? Hope so Maybe someone else can put it better for me.

It sounds as though your friend is getting ready to teach, rather than waiting for the student to come to her. The difference lies between pride and humility, and my worry is that actually it's your friend who is unprepared.

Whether or not you decide to join her coven is up to you. In my opinion, I would gain some experience (prayer, moving meditation, tea with your Deity - and yes, I mean that literally - reading, walks along the beach, basic rituals, etc) of your own before going with a group, so you can find what feels what's right for you. This may sound ethereal and airy fairy, but you will find what's best for you!



Dryad

I think maybe thats what i want to do, just talk to goddess and god. And learn to meditate i think,because i still don't really know how to do it



*edited to say*

thank you dryad for your post, i didnt see it until i finished writing this. My friend already has two girls in her coven, so i can't join until they get to level one she says, but she says like her girls haven't done spells yet so maybe thats why she doesn't think i'm ready. So i think i'll talk to the goddess and god and get to know them and such.. and forgive me but what is this tea with your Deity?(obviously i know what deity is but the tea bit, would you mind explaining please?).

Oh and basic rituals? what do you mean by this?

I'm terrible at meditation too! I've got the attention span of a gnat, so you know I could use some meditation to chill me out.

One method is to lie or sit comfortably, preferably when there's very little chance of being disturbed (or take your phone off the hook!). Breathe deeply. With each inhalation imagine your body being flooded with sparkling motes of light (or dark, as the case may be!). With each exhalation imagine your body relaxing, loosening, healing, becoming bouyant. Start at your toes and move up through your legs, your hips, your spine and back, from your fingertips to the very ends of your hair.

Breathe.

When you're ready, start paying attention to the outer world again, until you're ready to rise and continue on with your day or night. Or, as frequently happens to me, you fall asleep and wake up again.

This is pretty basic, and it may sound silly, but I'll bet you'll find time passes far more quickly than you might think!



Dryad

Thank you for that, will try it tonight and try do some when i feel stressed (Oh that all the time then! )

Oh, can you talk to your goddess and god during mediation too??

Thanks for your help

Bright blessings,

Mystical moon

I know some folks (Pomona, am I thinking of you??) on the site have literally had tea with their deities. Kind of like when you're a kid - you set out cups and saucers and teacakes, but instead of imaginary tea you make the real thing. As if you were having tea with a guest, except in this case your guest isn't actually physically present. (some with cats might disagree) Have a chat with your Deity, and if you don't have a deity (and many pagans don't), have a cup of tea with the Universe, or to honor the unnamed gods that might be about where you live. Or honor your ancestors.

As for rituals, well...here's a very basic one:

For beginners, I always recommend cleansing beforehand. Not that this is necessary so much as works as a focus for what you want to do. Whether this is showering or bathing with nice soap, moisturizers and the whole shebang or just standing/sitting in warm water, it's up to you. Some people like to put perfume on afterwards and dress in particular clothing, with jewelry that has meaning for them. Others go naked, it's personal choice.

Seeing as this is just a beginners ritual, with no particular purpose in mind other than 'feeling' out what it's like, at this stage you might want to light some incense or dance or just sit and give thanks for the beauty of the Earth and all the beings upon her.

If you're honoring ancestors or Deity, general recommendations include preparing items before hand, such as a little dishes of salt, sweet foods, wine/alcohol/juice/tea/coffee, sandwiches, crisps, things you think they'd like. For Deity, read up on what is sacred to them. For example, if I were honering Hestia/Vesta, the Greek and Roman Goddesses of the Hearth, I would have little dishes of grains, olive oil, honey, sliced fruit, and wine. For Hecate, I have spilled or eaten honey, pomegranate seeds, almonds, boiled eggs, garlic...

These are simple rituals, but ones I like todo. They can be as loose or as complicated as you like, although complication requires preperation! And of course, afterwards you can eat or otherwise dispose of any food item. I do recommend you have a cooling off period after every ritual, as they do put you in, well, a higher plane for a little while.



Dryad, hoping that helps!

Yes, absolutely!!

Dryad

I think with any solitary path you have to feel your way and learn to walk before you try running. There should be a balance between thinking, feeling and action.

For example, I am trying to get to grips with the Medicine Wheel. This is not a Wiccan thing, but it's similar. You have directions, and qualities that are associated with each direction. There are different traditions which place the four elements in different places, e.g. some put air in the west, and some water. So you ask people, "Why do you do it this way rather than the other way?" and they say, "Oh, you have to find which way is right for you personally", and then you thiink, But if I put air in the east and they put it in the west, how can I learn medicine circle from them?

So I am steppping right back from teachers and books, because I think I've got a bit of an idea now. I don't yet believe I can do medicine wheels, but I believe I can practice towards doing them. I made a rattle, and that took a few weeks. How do you begin to make a rattle? Well, it has a handle. I want a wooden handle. I go into a wood and ask what kind of wood to use. I faintly remember ash being a magical wood. Is it, or not? Never mind, it's the name that has come to me. Now how am I going to gather this wood? I don't want to hack it off a tree. It has to come to me. But I don't find any in that wood.

Later, on the road to Glastonbury Tor in fact, I practically fall over a branch of ash that has broken off the tree in the wind. I have done the thinking - now I do the feeling. Does this branch feel like my rattle? Yes. So then I act - I take a bit home with me.

Do you see? I haven't done a spell or a ritual yet, in the formal sense, but I'm feeling my way into it. Anyway, not to go on too long, but I have finished the rattle following the same long slow process, put it away for a few months because I didn't know what to do with it, got inspired to rattle it about a bit, and decided it was time to learn the medicine wheel. But first I must establish a relationship with the rattle. One of my teachers said he had a morning ritual which consisted of rattling all the directions. I know this is what I should do.

So then I have to find out where north is. Should I start my ritual with north? What does north mean? Well, it's what gives the compass its direction. The Pole Star is in the north. Northern Lights, snow, cold, mystery, exploration, danger. And so I get an idea what north means to me. Etc.

Every time I do the ceremony I improvise. I don't write anything down, because I'm trying to evolve something that is mine, and something I can use without referring to a bit of paper. It takes longer, but I believe it's worth it. In a year or two (depending how dedicated I am, lol!) I'll have a circle I can call up anywhere, any time, and do "stuff" in. I don't even know what form the "stuff" will take. Maybe I too will do spells, who knows.

So I think your friend is right to advise not plunging in at the deep end. Would you give a Dickens novel to someone just learning to read? Would you buy a Ferrari after your first driving lesson?

I cannot better the advice given so far especially the last from Julai - remember your path is your own - we all made faux pas to start with, we have all felt daft and muttered curses when we have forgotten the words we so wanted to say in ritual ... its part of the learning curve to feel your way and see what fits! Your inner dialogue with your deities is yours to choose - be that an out there ritual or an inner chat as I often do - the nature of the relationship is yours and theirs to find not for others to dictate. Spells and craftwork are so often wrapped in mystery and attaining levels before you can engage in some secret society - I dont go with the inner sanctum philosophy - find your own way love and keep asking questions!

just take small steps, be sensible, understand what you are doing, believe you can do it, try and do it, but don't just faff and dabble.

take it seriously and respectfully and take it as it comes.

i was'nt going to put a post in here but i think i should because i think its relavent.
i was gonna say this one of the great things about this site/ the valley, its funny how some questions are answerd in other peoples posts, don't you think!?.

its great to know were learning all the time about our paths and choices that lead to directions to go etc.


Alza

I would say that your friend is running before she can walk. If she really is guiding the others then she would do well to guide herself first. Sorry that my reply is a bit jumbled up, but there's many questions I want to answer and little time to do it

There is a HUGE difference between prayer and a spell. A prayer is simply that, a request for something and prayers are not a part of my path. Spell work is something done with intent, with the use of tools, or without the use of tools, but you need intent. The only other thing you need for a spell is yourself, I have worked without tools for years and I don't cast circles for magic work either. Ritual again is different to spell work, a ritual may have no magical need whatsoever but merely as a thanks to the gods or an hello. You can talk to the Gods where ever and when ever you like. For more info on meditation being something that many of us do have a look at various threads on that subject

Going back to the spell work, do you know why you want to perform spells? What is your purpose and need for this? There is very little in life that can't be done by the mundane which is what you should try first anyway, the Gods don't hand out gifts to those who don't seek hard ways of working it first. If you really have need of spells then try all means of achieving this by the mundane first and then you'll find the Gods will help you I used to do magic but now have next to no need. I'm not rich, I'm not healthy but I have everything I want.

I would suggest that you go your own way rather than following your friend who seems to have little grasp on magic and witchcraft. You may well find that you will be more advanced and more knowledgeable than she is before very soon You may also find that you are a witch and not wiccan which I am sure confuse her to no end

Listen to the land around you, feel it, be it, hear the Gods or the energy, let your Gods come to you, don't pick them out of a book because even if it does work it's a poor relationship compared to that of when the Gods come to you. Seek too hard and you miss the signs, but watch out for the pitfalls on the way and remember, witchcraft is a life long path of learning, damned hard work but worth it

wHAT everyone says.

Listen to yourself. Go sit under a tree, in a forest, quite serious.

Meditation isn't necessary, to be on the path.. helpful, useful, some can easily do it, others can't. Definately worth working at.. if you can..

Find what you feel good at, comfy with. Candles, colors, study of the trees, gemstones, the elements..Siver Ravenwolf has some good books, sorry sherrington , but i like her! lol

Read, reaad, Shirley MacClaine, Mary Summer Rain, find authors that speak to you, don't necessarily have to be on "wiccan path"..

you can learn a lot from above authors..and others have tons of books that they like.

You can pray anywhere!!! I mean, I'm guessing you already have been? God and the Goddess don't own watches!!! i'm copyrighting that expression!!! lol

Spells are quite different from prayer, more focus, more energy , more ritual, more intent. Now one doesn't have to use ritual, but I like it, tho I'm not a ritualistic person, lol, but it helps me focus.

as i keep telling newbies, hey relax, don't join any covens, for at least a year and a day.. imo.. Find out your own strenghts and beliefs, before you get involved in covens..
~~~~~~~~

Julai, how interesting, I'm into the medicine wheel too.. East is Air to me and where I start. It feels right, maybe bc my soul home is in Nc, in the east? Don't know.. Have you read Sun Bear..? He has a lot of interesting ideas.

well into native american things, haven't studied lots yet about medicine wheel, but it fascinates me and when I get my own land.,.. like someday, lol.. I will have one on my property!

gawd i must get off the puter!! lol

blessings moon! and all
whispered

Now then, naughty Whispered, rest those fingers, hey. Though actually, isn't exercise good for arthritis?

I haven't read Sun Bear. Authors I respect include Lynne Andrews, Carlos Castaneda, Leo Rutherford, John Matthews, Olga Kharitidi, Brian Bates...

Can I make two more points on this thread?

I don't feel any of us is in a position to judge this friend who has inspired Mystical Moon to take steps along a path which feels good to her. All we are entitled to say is, "Understand what she says, look in your heart to see how it feels, try if it works for you". Teachers come in all guises.

On the subject of meditation, my understanding of it is that it is the practicing of mental focus. Think about doing a spell and the candle flickers and thoughts of ghosts rush into your head. I cite this example as something that happens to me. You absolutely cannot get anywhere until you can hold mental focus. If you practice meditation lying down, chances are you will drift off to sleep. What would happen if you drifted off to sleep in the middle of a working?

Meditation practices such as focusing on your breathing, focusing on various parts of your body in turn, focusing on sounds, focusing on silence, are all designed to bring you into that calm, alert and utterly in-control state of mind that you need. When you design your meditation practice, make sure it helps you work towards this state. Make it easy by considering your surroundings, your body position and your preparation. Ritual helps because it sets up a habit.

By the way, I forgot to mention Dion Fortune, who is very good on meditation, but I don't remember the name of the book.

awww all your advice is so wonderful, thank you so much. But now i have too many thoughts in my head and can't cope ahhh!! lol. Ok so after reading everyones post, i get the impression your all making is...

Take it slow

and

Listen to what other people have to say, but follow what your heart tells you.

I've copied some meditation cd's off a friend of mine, i've never done meditating before, but i have read the previous posts about it, so i'll use those as a guide and see what happens.

I love candles, gemstones,tarot and herbs! So i want to work with them.

Weather witch made a point about i might want to be a witch but not a wiccan, i have heard people say this.. and i know wicca is a religion and witchcraft is working with the power of nature. Is that right? how i said it? But i don't understand it. Feel free to explain it in any words you can find.

Ok this proberly makes noo sence..im so tired, just got back from the gym. Any futther advice much appriciated and all advance given so far is very appricated too!! : )

Bright blessings,

Mystical_moon

EGADS! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

noooooooooooooooooooooooo

You can not ask what is the difference btwn a witch and a wiccan.. nooooooo LOL

it would boggle your mind, too much, as it does everyone elses and you would end up getting 40 Different replies!! LOL

Thats a totally separate post.. wait a year and a day, lol

I am the Queen of questions, but now is the time, to stop and just go meditate and Do and BE.

QUOTE

Take it slow

and

Listen to what other people have to say, but follow what your heart tells you.

from yourself, exactly!

soo go off, think for yourself , follow your heart , you'll be fine.

It is great you're asking questions, remember you've got a lifetime, on this path.. so.. take a bath, go visit nature and she'll answer, what u need to know now..

Have u done this yet? if not... do first..

relax, breathe.. have fun..

trust me, right now, it doesn't matter witch/ wiccan, doesn't matter.. go seek, and your own personal truth and answers will come.

Bright Blessings
Whispered`
not wiccan, but a witch LOL

Help Im scared. Im fairly new to Paganism having only recently become seriously interested in it, rather than just toying with the idea.
Like LadyAine in the other thread I feel really scared about becoming a Pagan and am uncertain what I should be doing and how to find my path.
I don't know very much about Paganism, as I have only been seriously interested in it for a few months. I really want to be Pagan from what I have researched so far. From what I have read on this site Im getting there. I feel a definate connection with being outside and nature and I care about these things. I care about people and have a generally benevolent and open minded nature. From reading these forums I feel I can identify with some of the people who's posts I read. Im not sure about connections with Gods. I don't know enough about the Gods. I also know very little about tarot, crystals, magic and festivals. There is so much to learn and so many seemingly conflicting paths that I am confused. I don't know where to start or who to turn to. When do I stop being someone who is generally exploring Paganism and be able to actually say "I am a Pagan?" I really want to say that. I already feel a sense of belonging being a wannabe pagan.
I havn't yet plucked up the courage to go out and meet Pagans in my area yet. It is something that I really need to do though but Im shy and dont know what to expect. Any advice info and encouragement would be extremely gratefully recieved!
Can anybody recommended web pages and books that I should look at to find out more information on all aspects of paganism.

I think firstly its important to realise that knowing about tarot, crystals, magic, herbs and so forth do not make you "pagan". Others may disagree with me, however, I feel being pagan is a state of mind, of being. If you feel you're pagan then chances are that's who you are. At the end of the day the term pagan is just a label to make a distinction about what you believe, although ironically there is no ironcald definition of what paganism means.

As to the exact path you will follow, well that's for you to find out yourself and its what you're already doing by researching. It is confusing there is much to learn, many paths, many conflicting views/opinions and while it does help to broaden one's outlook to think about other's opinions and to consider why someone feels a certain way about a path - at the end of the day you must trust your own judgement.

I would suggest starting out with something that is familar to you, that is part of your heritage, not that you have to stick with it, but its a good starting point. Anyone who has been on a pagan path for any length of time will tell you that it evolves and changes as you traverse it. I started off reading a lot on Wicca, in part because most books available are about Wicca. Don't just read books on magic, ritual, the sabbats etc, read books on myths on fairytales, folklore. Get books out of the library on herbalism, read about the environment and so forth. Perhaps try and read a few books pertaining to pagan history.

Be sensible and use common sense - if you decide you want to learn about magic then take it slowly, don't rush and don't try to run before you can walk. Read up on meditation, on visualisation techniques, perhaps even have a nosey at those Idiot type Guides on psychology/ Jung/ Freud/quantum physics and so forth.
Spend time thinking about what is important to you, what you feel you have an affinity for and then go out and research it.

You are already walking a path, you just don't have a name for it yet and there's no rush to label yourself - perhaps even think about why you're keen to announce yourself as pagan - what is your motivation, what do you hope it will achieve?

Hello rhys i can't chat much now but slow down and relax there's no need to be scared honestly.

I am also very new to all this and only been here a few months so i understand your feelings

I have just been to the neath moot and it was great but soo scary at first but so great by the end.

There is a cardiff moot which a few members from here attend and i also will be trying to attend the next one and i would be happy to meet you first and we can attend together (i will be shitting myself too )

If your ever want to chat to a swansea lass just p.m me and i will be more than happy to talk about what we are both going through.

I will be moving soon and coming up our way so it may help to now someone close by

The guys at the moot really made me ralax about being pagan and i am dealing with my path much better now (no expectations)and going with the flow.I now see my journey as life long and never ending so there's a lot of time to learn and enjoy my new found spirtual side(i am not planning on dying for a long time yet)

Seriously honey just chill out and email or p.m if you want a chat.

Blessed Be

sarah

Hi Rhys
First, slow down. Enjoy finding your path, that's part of the fun. I second everything Very says.

Pagan Paths by Pete Jennings is a good basic. It explains a number of the major Pagan paths, the festivals, Rites of Passage, Sabbats, etc.

Paganism by Joyce & River Higginbotham.
A very good all-round book, incorporating the above and a lot more besides. You might enjoy this as it is written for those new to, or exploring, Paganism.

The Modern Pagan by Brian Day. I love this book! It covers the roots of Paganism, but the majority of the book is given to nature, the garden, healing, education, living, etc. I think it is more of a follow-on from the first two.

Hope this helps.
BB
Ysbal

well firstly don't worry about feeling scared, there's a lot of stuff out there and a lot of it will be strange to you (heck some of its still strange to me ), but given time it will soon become, if not old hat, at least comfortable. Don't worry about your path, that is something that will come to you, probably without you realising it.

Not all of those qualities factor in all forms of Paganism, but they are valuable in themselves and will probably benefit you regardless of the path you find yourself on.

thats good to hear


don't worry about them. Believe me if they feel that you should know them, they'll be in touch. It might however turn out that you work best without them or that you will develop an understanding of the divine that does not include gods in the traditional sense.

Tarot is not a requirement of paganism, nor are crystals, magic or festivals. At this point you're probably thinking I've thrown the baby out with the bathwater, but its simply a matter of choice, especially at this stage in your endeavours. Festivals will vary depending on the path you tread; some seem pretty common to many paths but there are some which are unique to particular paths and there is no hard and fast rule that precludes you finding your own individual festivals if there is something that you particularly want to celebrate. Crystals and tarot can come later if you feel drawn to them (me I can't escape from runes, and I Ching keeps calling but I have little interest in the tarot or crystals) and magic is something that will probably pop up at some point but there is no guarantee your path will take it in.

understandable. And I'm afraid that there will always be more out there to learn. The best thing to do is browse the more accessable details and follow up any particular aspects that strike a chord. One day you will stop and take stock (something i recomend you do at regular intervals) and suddenly realise that your beliefs have crystalised and that you have been walking a path for some time.
Rhys, kneel before the sacred bladder and recite the sacred oath "I am a Pagan"
There you are, you're a Pagan. Its as simple as that, you are a Pagan if you think you are. True at first you might have doubts, but it wont be long before thinking becomes believing and to be honest as soon as you made the choice (possibly before) you were one. No-one says that you have to know everything (thank the gods for that ) and no-one says that you can't take wrong turns and dead ends on your journey; just consider them all as a learning experience.

Now that I can't really advise on as I have only ever met one Pagan before in my life (well one that said they were a Pagan), and as she was my exbosses boss it was not the most expected of meetings
So for this I will have to let the more social members offer advice.

On all aspects, blimey thats a tall order. I would refer you to Fool's Paradox but that might be seen as rather vane, and its not the be all of Paganism (after the rewrite it might be a step closer ) and there is little I doubt that you wouldn't find here (well apart from the SF&F coverage hmmm we must get a ''plugging'' smily ). Probably the closest would be The Internet Sacred Texts Archive (I can recommend ordering the CDROM BTW) and Encyclopedia Mythica, but to be honest there is just as much to learn from books on local history, natural history and keeping your eyes, ears and heart open to the changes in nature.

One word of advice though. When asking people, when browsing the net and even when reading some 'professional journals' don't be afraid to question and compare.

You never lose knowledge by asking a question, the same can not be said for not asking

Kev

oh and as for books I'd add the Ronald Hutton books, lots of sense, lots of history, low on perpetuation of modern piffle.

Kev

All of the above, from my learned friends, excellent advice!

Let me ask you this - why do you feel you could be Pagan? That's your starting point for research. What is it specifically?

Many pagans (I want to say all but I know there'd be someone out there who'd disagree ) feel an affinity with nature. Can I suggest you get out and actually think what your connection is? I hate to sound a cliche, but, spending time out of doors, actively concentrating on the sun and how it feels on your skin, how your skin smells different after being out in it, how you feel when you see the moon, and (though I don't advocate the tree-hugging until you've been properly introduced ) at least sitting with one and thinking about the tree. How it feels, how it makes you feel. How does the wind blowing make you feel, do you feel different when it blows another direction? Look at the insects, the mammals, how they interact with the plants and water etc. Really think about it.

Trust me, that's your best starting block (IMO) - getting out into nature and considering what it really means to you. You may well find that thoughts and ideas pop into your head providing you with more food for thought and somewhere else to go and read and study.

I'd also suggest you read some of the books recommended here (I particularly recommend Ronald Hutton's Pagan Religions of the Ancient British Isles, and Pete Jenning's Pagan Paths). I'd also recommend you have a look at books which deal with ancient myths (the Greek ones make really interesting reading in my view, plus they tie in with the constellations, plants etc - helps you see the connection between mythology, the gods, and the natural world) as well as the myths from Britain and folklore.

Believe me, you'll soon find that certain things will pique your interest - you've already felt an affinity with some of what has been discussed here, that will keep on happening to you, so don't feel you have to know it all at once - nobody does

And enjoy - this is fun! It's bloody hard work sometimes, but the thing worth attaining is the thing worth working hard for. And we're all here when you need to ask or want a hand.

Thanks very much all of you for replying to me. Some things are clicking into place. I don't think I expressed myself very well in my post. It really didnt come out how I was intending. A lot of things that all of you have just said I already knew, it had just gotten into a bit of a tangle in my head. I think Ive straightened most of it out now though. Ive read some more threads elsewhere too and that helped. I understood a bit more than I thought I did, thanks for helping me straighten it out. Ive also read your posts on some other threads too that have cleared up some things. I already realised that 'pagan' is a label that covers a very wide and individualistic set of beliefs and practices, but a common core of most of those are what I have already been following for several years. Like you said I am already walking a path, I just didnt have a name for it. It definately wasn't under the label of 'Christian' though and I was eager to label myself because I wanted to shake off the Christian label that my parents stuck on me. I also feel that I didnt want to be unlabled, but thats more of a social identity thing than a personal thing. I have been applying for jobs recently scratching my head wondering what to put on the religion section of the equal opportunities form. I come under the 'other - please specify' bit!
Im not worried about the Gods. I had a problem with the definition of the Christian God as an all seeing greater being. Like you say, they'll find me when they want to.
What I meant about not knowing about Tarot etc was that I would like to know more about them so I could explore them in my own time, rather than believing they were a requirement!
And by the info on all aspects of paganism bit, I got that wrong. I meant general information about the core aspects. It came out wrong!
Sorry about being a bit vague!
Thanks for the ideas about books and stuff. I'll try and find them. I got the Bryan Day book recently, I havnt looked at it much yet though.
I feel a bit better now Ive sorted a few things out.

In answer to Pomona, this is why I have been drawn to Paganism:

It is my affinity to nature that is a major reason I was drawn to Paganism. I love being outdoors. I get a sense of relaxation, wellbeing and exhileration from it. After being out all day even sitting around doing nothing outdoors I feel tired and I sleep well. The weather affects my mood. I enjoy listening to the wind in the trees and the sound of birds. I go surfing in my kayak and feel exhilerated by riding the waves. I enjoy seeing the changing of the seasons, the changing colour of leaves, the new plants and animals that grow, and the older ones that pass. I look up at the stars and wonder if there's someone like me looking up at the stars on another planet thinking the same as me. I climb hills and valleys that have been forged over millions of years. I feel part of it and I respect it. The plants, animals, seas, hills and weather keep me alive, but they can also kill me if I dont show them care and respect.
I take an interest in conservation and its social and political views and arguements, and on how I can do my bit to reduce my impact on the environment. I care that people are treated with dignity and respect and do not face prejudice and discrimination, whatever there race, sex, age, religion or otherwise.

I cant explain it fully without waffling on for ages and ages, but that about sums some of the main bits up.

Hi Rhys,

Well done mate. You're less scared than you were a few days ago, you understand a little more, you're closer to feeling happy with calling yourself "pagan". But it seems you've have the "seed" deep inside you for a long long time, and if love and wonder of the stars, sky and earth isn't pagan then I don't know what is.

I'm quite new to UKP too, and not good with crowds. I will be going to the next Cardiff moot, Rummer tavern, opposite the castle, Sunday 2nd April, 8pm. I have made one or two friends there, and enjoy the talks on pagan subjects. If you would like to go you would be made very welcome. I'm glad that seg (Helen) has mentioned her intention to visit the Cardiff moot (all the way from Swansea - dedication!

Books, I have many books. One particularly close to my heart is "Hedge Witch" by Rae Beth. A most unusual and enlightening collection of episodes!

Bye,

Scyld

And don't forget to read some good old fashioned mythologies! Whether it be Greek, Roman, Viking, Irish, Welsh, Egyptian or whatever takes your interest most. That's a good way of finding out about the gods and goddesses and how they play (and a lot of them don't play fair).

And nose around this site as well - there's always something to be learned.

I think once you start reading/reseraching and just talking to other Pagans that your path will find you. Read critically, don't accept everything that your told or you read. If something seems useful or poignant to the path that you're following take it on board. If on the other hand it doesn't seem right to you, discard it.

If you can find local Pagan's through a teaching circle, open ritual or local moot that can also help you find your path.

As to books, like Scyld I quite enjoyed the Rae Beth books and also Kate West. I think that they can be quite eye opening and a good starter.

Q

Hon, I didn't mean to make it sound like an interview question "convince us that you have an interest in paganism and why"! LOL! Just that generally your starter for 10 is what your interest already is - it's just a case of developing it.

Personally if I was asked that, I'd just stick to "pagan" as anything else will just get too complicated and might not actually work in your favour after all - although we're all nice tolerent folks here, people "out there" aren't always as open minded however "equal opportunity friendly" they might say they are.

As far as knowing where to begin, well after over a decade of "doing" this paganism stuff, I'm still learning and weaving my path, and after a year out of the scene coupled with a spiritual shake up, I almost feel that I am once more just starting out again... it never ends... open a can of worms and you are asking for trouble!

Like the others have said though, start with what moves you, what aspects of "paganism" interest you, and leave the rest for later. You've got bags of time.

In friendship,

F

True. Many from organised religions (Chrisitans in history such as John Dee and Culpepper for example) were associated with either herbs, scrying etc. and they would hardly be called Pagans.

Hi Rhys - first off as all the others have said slow down take a deep breath and relax and take a step backwards.

You have made a big step forward deciding you are pagan. there are as you have seen lots of different paths - confusing at first. What are your interests myths egypt vikings etc etc etc. Then read up around them.

I started off wiccan then progressed to eclectic paganism - meaning i didnt have a path, and now i dont know. i need to do some more reading.

Dont worry about tarot and crystals. thatll come in time. if its something that you find interesting look into it. start with things that you find more interesting.

As for the Cardiff moot the guys who go are AMAZING people. they dont bite at all and they are very friendly. honest. i dont get the chance to go very often but i try to turn up for the big meets - and the meals my first time i was petrified. i made a point of meeting up with a couple of people before my first moot, so i actually knew people.
you will be fine and feel free to pm me anyone in the cardiff area who is nervous or wants more info

Most of all have fun and enjoy yourself

Sorry. It just helped to write something down. You never know somebody might have been interested! I guess Im still a bit nervous about what other people think about me and my motives.

I would suggest put down the books, get out into the Land and see what the plants, animals, trees, weather, Sun, Moon and stars can teach you. everyone gets confused with booklearning, there are so many different interpretations. let nature show you Her wisdom for awhile, it will help you make sense of the rest.

BB Midori

Perfectly put Midori! Just get out when it becomes too much, and take rest in Nature. Outdoors is my favourite place!

Scyld

Hi Rhys

Try to get a book by Starhawk, its a good foundational starting point.
There are many types of Pagan as there are Paths.

My path is Gaia, Being One with all life on the planet, and trying to fit in with the eco chain. Footprint etc...

Humans and ferocious human eating beasties are the hardest to be 'One' with.

Welcome fellow Pagan
Marc

Hmmmm.... I mean... hmmmmm... Starhawk, sorry, just wouldn't be anywhere on my recommended reading list unless it was to just point someone in the direction of pap. In my opinion. Far better, I think, going right back to the very beginning and reading the ancient myths, books on ancient history, archaelogy, to get something that's a bit more factual than Ameriwicca (no offense to our American Wiccan friends).

I wouldn't rule out reading anything by Starhawk, especially if you feel that ecofeminism is your path, but I would suggest you get a wider view, preferebly grounded in history (points at those Hutton books) before specialising in some thing like that.

Oh and try to limit the books that have publishers beginning LL and sounding welsh

Kev

PS Ameriwicca - I like it

Heh heh!

Ask a dozen Pagans and get two dozen points of view ...

My advice, based purely on my own experience such as it is, is to try everything you can. By the time you have either read up or tried three or four different paths (moots are a good source of information) you will have a better idea of what it is that you want and whether it can be found in an organization or on your own personal path.

I went through phases of Wicca, Heathenry and looked into traditional witchcraft before settling on a Druidic Path. I feel that in so doing I have gained a depth of knowledge that has been invaluable to my current path. There are lots of interesting and exciting things out there so enjoy the journey! having said that, I feel it pays to settle down to a core path sooner or later if only to provide a focus for your energies.

...two dozen and two!

I go along with the general comments, I would add that if you read something that says YOU MUST or THIS IS THE ONLY WAY ignore it! Go with what you feel, if it feels right then it is more often than not right.

Wishing you well on your journey along your path

Zaf

Exclnt post Rhys you put in words perfectly how i am feeling, I to am new to this path and am getting slightly confused thinking i dont know about gods etc, but i do love nature, i especally love walking in the rain and feeling it on my face and hair and when i see the moon i get all butterflys i feel im so close to it ( does that sound silly? ) anyway many thanks for making me feel im not alone

BB
Anubis
XXX

Dear Pomona,

"Hmmmm.... I mean... hmmmmm... Starhawk, sorry, just wouldn't be anywhere on my recommended reading list unless it was to just point someone in the direction of pap. In my opinion. Far better, I think, going right back to the very beginning and reading the ancient myths, books on ancient history, archaelogy, to get something that's a bit more factual than Ameriwicca (no offense to our American Wiccan friends)."

OK. I'll take the risk of standing up for a bit of Ameriwicca . I've done a little Reclaiming training, and respect a few folk I know who're pretty deep along that path, Enough to know it's not my path, and never could be. But I don't think Starhawk deserves to be lumped in with pop- or pap-Wicca. Behind all the naive ideology and wishful history, it is a system which can and does get people working with the hard and sacred realities of being born, living and dying in this world. 'The Spiral Dance' touched a lot of people all those years ago, and I'd be surprised if many of them took it as holy writ. Books like that are probably more valuable for the questions they start you asking than the answers they give. That said, some of the answers are good ones.

Of course the pseudo-history and the mix & match approach to deities will grate on Europeans who are grounded in the mythologies of their own lands. But she's coming from a culture that really is a melting pot, in which the memories of conquest are recent enoughto give the dominant peoples an ambivalent relationship with the memories of landscape they inhabit. It probably works better for them than the rather ridiculous pretensions to 'pure' Eurpoean heritages you find in some American groups,

Like I said, it's not my path but there's something I really admired about Starhawk's earlier writing. She didn't pad her books out with too much in the way of tedious ritual stage-directions for how to do this or that. She wrote, and wrote rather beautifully at times, about what made her believe what she believed. She thought that what you believed should change the way you lived. She had passion and commitment for a vision of Witchcraft that aimed to transform the society it emerged from, and she often enough put her body on the line for it.

OK, some of her followers have turned that vision into a politically-correct dogma that might as well be the patriarchy they hate so much. But much of that specifically feminist Witchcraft - not just Starhawk but also that inspired by thinkers such as Christine Downing, Carol Christ and many others, fed back into the Wicca, and the broader Paganism, of these islands during the 80's and, I'd reckon, helped break down a lot of the conventional sexual stereotyping of both human and divine roles that went on then. She deserves credit for that. Like you, I can find a lot to disagree with in her books but I'd still suggest she's one of the more significant thinkers and writers in the modern Pagan movement.

Of course you're right. Reading the ancient myths, and what history and archaeology can tell us of the mental landscape that engaged with them, is essential to renewing the connections that have become so terribly eroded over the Christian centuries. But there's surely a place for finding new mythologies within our much-changed modern cultures too?

It feels strange to be defending Starhawk when I disagree with a fair proportion of what she says, but I stiill think there's an approach to Witchcraft, and a vision of social transformation, in there that's worth respecting. Perhaps - it's late and I've drunk too much wine to be coherent so please forgive the wooly ramblings here - I feel she's worth disagreeing with, whereas pop=Wicca is only worth dismissing.

BB,

John Macintyre

Rhys,

By now I hope the crisis stage has passed and your'e closer to being more in harmony with yourself, and that you're not too confused.

but to add my tuppenth worth,

My own personal experience is of wandering around not knowing what I was for some time, but realising that I couldn't in all honesty call myself a christian any more. My way into paganism began with runes and thay still play the largest influence in what I belive and what I do. I am finding however that I am spreading outwards. I guess that either the runes and norse gods are only a part of where I am heading, or that maybe 15 years down the line I have changed and so has my faith/path. I think it is also worth mentioning that while the path we are on says where we are and where we have come from on our journey, none of our journeys are over. We still have new ways to explore, both in this life and the next.(or so I belive anyway) I think the travelling is more important than what road you are on or how far down it you are.

sending you positive thoughts

AW

The first step for anyone interested into paganism is study. I highly reccomend too books that will get you a very good foundation and are a lot more of a comfortable and easy read than most. These books are:
To Ride A Silver Broomstick by Silver RavenWolf.....she may be fluffy but she gets things clear and simple
A guide For the Solitary practionner by Scott Cunningham

Read BOTH of these books and you will have a good starting base. Then start of with simple acts such as daily devotion, then clensing and consecrating items then perhaps casting a circle etc. Do things step by step until you feel comfortable. But do not rush yourself!

I can second the suggestion to read Ronald Hutton - he's clear, to the point, academically rigourous and well researched.

Also - getting outside is good - either in the great outdoors to meditate, think and observe (this is probably an important part of most pagan paths) or to the pub for moots and events.

Question everything you read and everything someone tells you, try things you're not sure of, and take your time. I've been reading for over six years and I've never cast a circle in my life. I'm still pagan.

Oak

(edited to correct typos)