What a wonderful day. Hail and gales has cleared the sky - beautiful blue, sun shining, feeling more energised than I have in a long time. Body appears to be well and truly on the mend, though the penicillin hasn't completely worked hopefully my natural defenses can do the rest.

I find there's nothing like a bout of something really horrible to give you a new found appreciation for life. The relief and rejuvenation after illness is like breathing in after holding your breath 'til it hurts. After time, the feeling of being healthy and strong becomes just another background sensation, but the first few days of true 'wellness' after illness bring that enjoyment to the surface and makes it something to behold. I have been enjoying it all day by singing in the shower, bouncing about the house and making silly gaga noises at the world.

This was the first seriously nasty bout of illness I’ve had on my own, fully responsible for my own welfare, no other half making sure I’m eating, bringing me drinks in bed or nagging me to go to the doctor’s. At times it was quite a trial to take responsibility for myself when all I wanted to do was not move and stay under the duvet until I either recovered or died - melodramatic but at one point I was so weak because I hadn't drunk anything or eaten that I would put up with wrenching hunger pains rather than move.

But something that I did, that I have always done, that kept me going in a way was to tidy up after my illness - to clear away the debris in a ritualised form that marked my gentle progression back towards health.

The first marker for me was when the fevers and chills eventually evened out and stopped. My bed was sour with the smell of sweat, which was almost comforting because it smelled so strongly of me and of sleep. For four days I had mostly just lain there drifting in and out of sleep and struggling to feed myself (at the worst point my tonsillitis was so bad that it took me two hours to eat a mashed banana - crying all the way). I finally went to the doctor and one day after starting the penicillin the shivers and shakes had almost completely ceased. The day after that, with huge effort, I took my bedding and my night clothes downstairs and put them through the washing machine on a high heat. This was my first marker of health. Washing away the illness from my bed clothes.

The sensation of getting into clean, fresh bedding that night brought a profound sensation of relaxation and mending.

The next marker, and the most beneficial of all, was when I became well enough to wash myself properly. I had gone for a number of days without washing at all: if I took my cloths off I was instantly shivering, I felt too weak to stand for long and my body hurt. Washing very quickly becomes a secondary concern.

The first shower was like a baptism. Hot, relaxing water. Washing away the smell of illness from myself.

One thing men probably don't know about women is that, when we get ill and we can't maintain our daily grooming routines, we get quite hairy Our armpits and our legs, which are usually shiny enough to see your face in, resemble the Himalayan Yeti. I actually really like that sometimes - there's a great sense of satisfaction in growing your leg hair, bit like I guess blokes get with a beard lol

There is something, for me, very ritualistic in shaving that hair after illness. It is like the hair on your head - it is a record of your life, where you have been, what you have thought, how you have felt. Leg and armpit hair is a funny thing because it grows relatively quickly, so if you stop shaving when you become ill then when you are able to shower again all of that shaggy carpet growth came through during your illness. It bears witness to your low point. So my first shower was not only about washing the smell of illness off my body, it involved shaving the hair growth off as a symbol of me reclaiming my body and taking back possession of it. It returns a lovely feeling of cleanliness, femininity, control and, yes, health.

By this second stage I was well and truly on the mend.

My third marker was somewhat smaller in stature but never-the-less important. After a couple of weeks in which I had under-eaten due to the pain and my body had finally flushed itself out (quite violently), I was ready to mark the return of my apatite by cooking myself a very big and nutritious meal. After you haven't eaten for a while you find it hard to eat large portions, but I filled my plate and, taking it nice and slowly - being in no rush - I finished it off. My digestive system isn't back to 100% standard, there's still a few hiccups here and there but that meal marked the end of illness' claim on my internal system. My guts and I are working together again as friends.

My final marker, which I have not yet taken (saving it for later this week), is to wrap up nice and warm and go for a right good, brisk and bracing walk; get some air back in those lungs. I have been laying in bed or sitting around the house for almost two weeks now. Although I have lost weight from being ill, I find it tough work getting up the stairs from the kitchen to my attic. My body is in stasis and needs building back up with some gentle but pressing exercise.

For me, when I’m ill, water plays such a central role. It washes away illness from both my surroundings (bedding) and myself. It relaxes, sooths and cleanses. I think it is my favorite element, if you can have a favorite.

Marking the stages of illness and recovery on a physical level can also be used on a spiritual level. I wonder quite seriously about the connection between this illness and some events over the past few months. It was interesting that the infection only ravaged the one side of my throat - which was the same side I was stabbed back in October. Since then I haven't been dreaming much and the dreams I have had have taken on an odd quality that I haven't fully understood. It is also not uncommon for people to suffer illness after bereavement and there are a number of personal feeling that I have about that. So the illness itself has been a living entity, taking possession of me, controlling me, incapacitating me and now, gradually, releasing me as I have triumphed over it and it has cleansed me. Marking those little triumphs are so important - as in daily life. If we do not mark those little successes that we have and if we do not recognise our progress then nobody else will bare witness to it for us. In that respect, illness is a great teacher lol

Do other people have healing processes that they go through? Things you do when you're ill, or after you get better? I was wondering what illnesses have affected people - any that have brought on spiritual realisations, or taken them away? What lessons have people learned from illness, how do people view it - what is it's role in your life?

Best wishes,

Marion.

Marion
I think this is fascinating. How amazing to be so "in tune" with your body.
I've never really thought about it, and it's on a much smaller scale, but I find something very theraputic about hair washing after illness.
Thank you for sharing.
Orchid
X

I'd never really thought about this, but you are bang on the money.

The almost ritual nature of ablutions after illness. Showering, de-fuzzing, hair washing, changing the bed linnens (getting into clean sheets is a simple magic all of its own) the 'I'm on the mend' type feast.

I know that when I've been ill I visualise the last residue of illness to be sucked and swirled down the drain.

As to lessons learnt from illness (which in itself throws up notions about should we perform healings, are illnesses learning opportunities, that healing may be tampering with?). I think my biggest teacher was my epilepsy. It taught me to appreciate my freedom and independance, cos when it whapped away from you at 16 you really miss it (needing an escort to walk down the shops, being told not to have more than an inch of bath water etc etc etc). How kind strangers can be, once two young people stayed by my bedside until someone arrived at the hospital to be with me. The importance of screaming 'F**king Ada' and 'Nolite tes Bastardes Carborundum' when it all seems to be getting on top of you. I could go on you know, but there just a taster.

Q

I have luckily only had really bad flu a couple of times in my adult life. ive had heavy colds sure, but really bad flu where you're bed ridden etc I've had as I say only twice.
HOwever, I remember, wuite clearly, the worst bout of flu ever, and it was a couple of newyears ago. I was completely bed-ridden for two weeks, too weak to go any further than the loo and back, and like MArion, couldnt (and didnt want to) wash or walk or even brush my teeth. I stank, the bed stank in fact, the bedroom reeked of sweat and illness. I was so ill at one point tho, that I had a high fever and started to hallucinate and "zone out". I had no concept of time or place and had some very stranges visions and dreams. Most were of struggle (obviously my body talking to me and showing what was going on internally), some were of jsut blackness and strange colours, reds adn oranges like a burnign fire.
The turning point for me, was when I finally decided to open my bedroom window. Even tho it was pretty cold outside, I felt I needed some fresh air in the room. Just feeling the cool air around me and hearingn the birds outside was enough to start giving me some strength. And alos, after a couple more days, is changed my bedding and had a lovely soak in the bath. I felt clean and rejuvinated.
It took me almost 2 months to fully recover my strength back, but interestingly, looking back on that period in my life, it was at the same time as my relationship was on a real low and was under tremendous stress at work.
I truly beleive your body reaches a breaking point due to emoitional stress and this makes you vulnerable to illness. BUt with incapacitating illness (briefly that is) comes a chance to take stock and slow down.
Well thats how I feel, and right now, having just come out of a very abusive and difficult relatioship I feel almost the same, as if Ive just woken up and recovered from being ill. Ive even carried out the same sort of ritual cleansing in the bath and am re-decorating. Clearing out the bad, the stale and bringing in the fresh and new.

tree x

I love that term. That's a good term



Now that's an interesting one. The plug hole has some strange magical property lol I remember when I used to have a bath (only got a shower here), I’d use it really rarely because I’ve always preferred showers, but sometimes I’d run myself a full-on relaxing, essential oils, rose petals and candles type bath. I'd usually do this if I’d had a particularly stressful time and I needed serious therapy time. I'd lay and soak for an hour or more. Read a book, sip wine, meditate on the swirling vapours rising up.... Then, when it came to get out of the bath, sometimes I’d stand up and push the water down off my body with my hands, shaking my feet as I got out, then pull the plug or I’d sometimes actually stand there in the tub watching the water go down - and it carried away my stress and my peevishness, I saw the plughole gobbling it up and carrying it away. Plug holes are wonderful things.



Wow, you're epileptic? Now that's interesting. My mate is too and we have some mental discussions about his epilepsy and my auric migraines (which have quite a few commonalities, both being neurological fruckers), and the spiritual implications of it.



LOL que?



I find epilepsy fascinating. I know naff all about it but there's a real weight of mythology around it in backwards civilizations (y'know, the ones who haven't got the benefits of the NHS and such like). Sure sign of a shaman to some, sign of spirit attack in others etc. It's interesting how it just randomly starts with some people and others have always had it.

My mate's always forgetting to take his spaz tabs (as he lovingly calls them ) and goes through phases where he'll have a succession of attacks. I used to suffer severe auric migraines - my body would go numb, I’d lose the use of half my body (full on stroke effects), I’d have visual hallucinations, lose my speech, fallover/walk into things etc. Then the pain would come and it's the nearest thing I guess I'd equate to death - in that at times I wanted to die to get away from it, seriously, if someone had offered me the option I wouldn't have hesitated. My mate talks about the pain following a fit and it actually sounds worse than I used to get - don't envy in the least but it's one of those weird things that I’d actually like to have an epileptic fit just once in my life to know what it feels like, what it does.

I haven't got around to it but I know there are some books that explore the shamanic significance of symptoms relating to these neurological disorders. One of the ones I sometimes get is that I 'detach' from my arm. My arm is not my arm anymore, it has a life of it's own and it freaks me out because it is not attached to my body and it takes real mental effort not to panic and just to accept that the hand is part of me, not someone else’s hand that wants to do me harm lol - sounds a bit absurd but it's a really bizarre sensation. I had my first every purely auric migraine about 9 months ago. Usually I get the auric side then three hours later the pain hits. This one was the auric jazz but then no pain. I had no idea what was going on but it was like taking a very mild acid trip for an hour. I was chuffed.

If that side of things interests you I’ll ask my friend what the books are (he's got a library to rival Alexandria), I’d like to have a nose myself once I’ve cleared everything else I want to read at the moment.

But there has to be a deep connection with something like that - it's got a hold of you in a way that affects your daily life, it controls you in a cruel way in as much as you can't tell when it'll come get you, you don't have a choice in that. Something like that must build a profound relationship with the 'host'. Do you see it as part of who you are or something external that comes and goes? I'd love you to talk about what it's like if you don't mind - the experience of a fit. Unless I’m talking sh!t and you're thinking 'what is she waffling on about, loonie' lol Like I say, I don't know a huge amount about epilepsy and I’ve never had it

Best wishes,

Marion.

Hey TH



It's interesting that. I've been thinking about it recently and I don't think i've ever actually had proper flue in my entire life (famous last words) - plenty of nasty colds but not actual flue.



Woooow. Good stuff (in a bad way lol). Fever seems to be one of the conditions that brings on hallucinations/visions. It's really good what you say about the visions of your struggle. I think there is a communion between the psyche and the flesh and this does come through more strongly at crisis points like illness. I guess cravings during pregnancy and illness are like that too on a smaller scale. A lot of shamanic medicine (most well known probably Native American) works with those visions in healing people, bringing people back from comas, expelling the spirits of illness etc.

The question of whether we should heal or not is a really good one. I think it's only human nature - actually, animal nature - to try to heal ourselves. Horses, elephants and other animals are known to eat stock herbs when they have specific ailments. Mankind has always worked on both the material (herbs/lotions/potions) level and on the spiritual level (hands-on, energy transfers, chanting) level - it's what we do. I think before the dawn of modern medicine though there was more of a communion with the body and the illness, today we have so many kick-ass drugs we just assume we pop a pill and 90% of the time the problem goes away, there's no need to have a discussion with spirit about it. I'm not sure modern medicine is always a bad thing, I have a lot to thank it for, but I think we should be rightly suspicious of things that seem too easy sometimes in that new cures also usually bring new problems whilst at the same time resolving some of the older ones.



lol - I’m laughing because I know that feeling and it's a poignant one. It's like, when you get that ill, you're in some sort of cocoon - your bed and your room become this stagnant healing chamber where nothing happens except utter defeat. The 'opening of the window' is a seriously significant step in the healing process - that rejoining of the inside of the cocoon with the world outside; a sign of life after the metamorphosis. I think that's quite a good image actually - some cocoons don't make it through the winter, they never open again come spring - the window remains shut, but those that do have the strength to make it can throw open that window and breath deep the fresh, clean air. Modern medicine ensures that the majority of cocoons open again in the spring, but still, it's a good thing to recognise and appreciate.



The link between what goes on in our lives and our illnesses is something that is much under-acknowledged I think. It'd be great if someone took on that research properly - not just 'ermm, well, I think your third chakra is blocked. Have some camomile tea' - but really tackled it head-on from a sane perspective.

The last major illness I had was about 4/5 years ago and it was another childhood one (I class things like tonsillitis as a childhood illness because I haven't had it since I was a kid and adults don't tend to get it as often). I had just finished uni, moved to Colchester, had a crappy time with a job, decided to move back to move in with man and it was the day before we were to move into our first place together (our first un-shared place together), and I came down with chickenpox! I was gobsmacked. I'd had chickenpox in my mummy's tummy (they mistook it for rubella and told her to have an abortion - unluckily now for some, she refused lol) but i'd never had it as an actual living, breathing, walking around child. Still, I was pretty surprised, and quite miserable about it.

Looking back at that it's interesting to draw the parallel because back then:

uni came to an end, huge change in circumstances, moved many miles away to new place, had crap time in job, quit, travelled back to a place I wasn't thrilled about, started living with someone, moved house....

now:

split up with someone/end of relationship, moved house (back into shared accom), had shit time in job, quit, started uni, nana died.

Similar themes involved in very large doses. Lot of stress all happening at once. Thing about stress is often you don't realise you are - so much is going on that you're just getting on with it and it's not 'til you stand still and look back that you really understand just how much has been going on.



I think you're spot on there. Illness isn't one of those things you can say 'oh, I’ll do that tomorrow' like you can with relaxing - it's an immediate 'you will stop now.' I think the link between emotional welfare and illness is huge. Until about November (when I got a yucky cold/cough) I hadn't been ill at all in about 9 months - picture of health and I’d been pretty bouncy and happy - on a high. Recently I haven't been like that, i've been a bit on and off, lots on my mind - all serious and stuff. I tried to do the Metta Bhavana meditation last night an just couldn't even begin - I spent quite a while just meditating on why that was and just drifting through my mind and emotions. It's a null and void that I haven't felt for some time. I think part of it is just grief at the moment, Christmas was an absolute whirlwind, then the illness straight after - no time to get blue, just trying to keep going. So now I’m calm, collected, well and it's all bubbled up (plus i've been taking a course of panax ginseng which untied the knots of emotional constipation like the crochet needle of doom lol). I'm just letting it wash over me really.

I think the end of illness like that is quite a marker. Like remembering the last time I was that ill. You can look ahead and try and learn from it; try and work health into your daily routine - take the time out for yourself, eat the right things, nourish body and soul, try to avoid building up that stress. Thing is, you do forget pain and suffering quite a bit when it's gone away and after a while you forget why you're doing certain things and slip back into old habits



Good for you gal! I wish you the very best of confidence and encouragement. Perhaps through the ritualisation of the cleansing experience you will avoid the physical illness that can follow deaths/break ups/trauma - perhaps that is the way to do it. I realise I talked a lot about marking the stages of getting well after physical illness, but after all of the major unpleasant events over the past year, I haven't stopped to mark one of them properly. Hmmm. Wonder what that says.

Best wishes,

Marion.

Some men do

I just read the best article last night. It's in the Dreamflesh journal (see book reviews) I bang on about. It's called 'Strawberry fair, armpit hair' and it's one good heathen woman discussing the social recoil of meeting hairy women lol She is absolutely brilliant. It's a really interesting one though. Since I was old enough to grow armpit hair I’ve shaved it off. I'll let my leg hair grow if I’m just dossing around or on me tod but the moment there's a whiff of a date I’ll be in the bathroom shaving. It becomes part of the daily ritual of life for most women.

I remember seeing a young woman, about mid-20s in a mini skirt and boots once and she had really hairy legs. It really stuck in my mind. I think I could count on maybe one hand the number of times I’ve seen hairy legs on women. There aren't enough of them to compare against smooth legs in order to decide what I think about it lol

Hairy chins, hairy legs, hairy armpits...non of your Venus de Milos have awt like that. I'm thinking when I head off travelling, living out of a me car etc later this year, I may just grow my body hair for a month or two just for the hell of it, see what I think lol

What about blokes here - any of you in to shaving more than your chins?

Marion.

I wax legs, armpits, chest and arms
I shave chin mostly twice a day.

Do you ever get any interesting comments about that? One of my mates is as hairy as a moderately-hair ape, but for some genetic reason he has two strips, one up either leg, where hair just doesn't grow at all - totally shiny; looks waxed but isn't. We often comment 'mate, you have legs a girl would kill for' - if you could isolate the miscreant gene that does it you'd be a millionaire in the beauty market. (I was about to say 'health and beauty market' but oddly those two concepts never really equated with me as things that make you beautiful usually aren't so healthy for you lol).

Do you just like the feel or is it in the name of 'sport' (yuh right)?

Marion.

I feel it helps me express my femininity. I am someone who feels comfortable in skirts as well as trousers.
I don't believe clothes should be gender specific.
Women wear trousers so why can't men wear skirts.
My wardrobe is mixed. (infact I have more skirts than trousers)

They are a lot more comfortable in the hot weather to as I am sure you know.

I keep my legs waxed because I hate shaving them and it lasts about a week and I am out in town in a skirt at least twice a week and you get a lot less hassle if you have smooth legs.
People tend not to notice too much if I at least look femanine

I tried waxing. Couldn't get on with it at all. My friend was very in to sugar waxing though - apparently it's better for the environment because the sugar dissolves or something, and you re-use cloth strips rather than buying new ones each time. Not sure what brand she was using.

I tried Immac - I was impressed but so impressed I quickly thought 'this really cannot be good in any way shape or form for either myself or the environment' lol

Blokes in skirts and women with leg hair seem to be on about a par as far as social phobia goes. I know David Beckham tried to make sarongs acceptable but I don't think he quite cut the mustard. I like your stance on dress, I’ve seen a few guys do it but very few and far between (again, like women proudly displaying leg hair).

It is interesting how there's no longer a stigma for women who dress masculine. My mother often talks about the days when she wasn't allowed to wear trousers to work and how that made her feel - especially an oppressively male-dominated situation the last thing you feel like doing is showing your legs. Quite a vulnerable situation to be in and the stigma of wearing trousers lead to all sorts of unpleasant comments by letchey old farts. Sometimes it’s about comfort rather than expression – as with skirts and hot weather. Sometimes it’s just about expression.

I have a personal love of wearing ties. I adore them, but I rarely ever wear them - it's often a step too far in the masculine dress-up game. But I sometimes like to combine the two genres: trousers, pinstriped shirt, tie, mafia hat (all very masculine)...and high heels lol A man's suite with high heels on a woman can work so well. But yes, I’ve always had a tie fetish, I love them on women/myself. There's just something about ties. Men rarely do them justice lol

There tend to be gods in many cultures that transcend gender or possess elements of both male and female. As above, so below.

Best wishes,

Marion.

I use immac and hair removal cream, not sure what impact that has on mother earth


I agree what you are saying about ties and suits with high heels. I have on occasion worn these to work. Usually I disguise the fact by a reason. Like fancy dress for red nose day (where I wore a long red ball gown with high heels)
Wrong trousers day I wore my suit jacket with with shirt and a pin striped skirt and high heels ( and yes a tie)
My excuse was "Its wrong trousers day and whats more wrong than wearing a skirt" my boss found it amusing.
And varies charity events at work where i will get sponsered to walk around in high heels (hee hee I am quite good at walking in them )

I have a female friend who loves to wear mans suit and tie with top hat etc. I think she only owns one skirt LOL. We are like opposites. She is such a man.

I have a nice flowing skirt I wear to ritual and there is nothing more wonderful than dancing around the circle with my skirt fluttering about.
An the wonderful thing about Pagans is that they don't give a damn what you wear and who you are aslong as you share thier love of worship.

I would love the time where clothing would not fall into a gender bracket and that I could go out in public without the fear of being judged. wearing what ever I feel like .

I think sadly that is a long way off.

[quote]Wow, you're epileptic? Now that's interesting. My mate is too and we have some mental discussions about his epilepsy and my auric migraines (which have quite a few commonalities, both being neurological fruckers), and the spiritual implications of it. [/quote]

[quote]'Nolite tes Bastardes Carborundum'[quote]

Don't let the bastards grind you down!

[quote]I find epilepsy fascinating. I know naff all about it but there's a real weight of mythology around it in backwards civilizations (y'know, the ones who haven't got the benefits of the NHS and such like). Sure sign of a shaman to some, sign of spirit attack in others etc. It's interesting how it just randomly starts with some people and others have always had it.[/quote]

I always used to tell folks I was possessed by demons, epilepsy just sounded so 'blah'. It helped to get in the front of the queue at supermarkets too.

[quote]My mate talks about the pain following a fit and it actually sounds worse than I used to get - don't envy in the least but it's one of those weird things that I’d actually like to have an epileptic fit just once in my life to know what it feels like, what it does.[/quote]

I didn't have pain, other than the thumping headache when you've crushed you head into a table leg. However, I have some interesting visuals. Another odd thing was that if I seized and no one was around I would always smell lily of the valley, which was my nan's 'scent' and feel my hair being stroked. So ghostly interventions or weird visual/offactory hallucinations?

[quote]I haven't got around to it but I know there are some books that explore the shamanic significance of symptoms relating to these neurological disorders.[/quote]

Ooh yes please, if you can post any links to books on that it would be great to read up.

[quote]But there has to be a deep connection with something like that - it's got a hold of you in a way that affects your daily life, it controls you in a cruel way in as much as you can't tell when it'll come get you, you don't have a choice in that. Something like that must build a profound relationship with the 'host'.

Do you see it as part of who you are or something external that comes and goes? I'd love you to talk about what it's like if you don't mind - the experience of a fit. Unless I’m talking sh!t and you're thinking 'what is she waffling on about, loonie' lol Like I say, I don't know a huge amount about epilepsy and I’ve never had it [/quote]

It does have a profound effect. I've not had a seizure for years now and I stopped taking the meds (to my consultants consternation - they had no damn effect on my epilepsy managment but thats a whole different story).

That said it was me, it was a part of me, and it made me me (if that makes sense, I was that odd goth girl, you know, the anti weeble [i.e. I wobbled but I DID fall down]). At the peak of my epilepsy, I was having 8- 10 seizures a week, and one fornight I clocked up 200+ seizures, fun not!

However, sonething that did happen a few times, was I would try to out run a seizure, I sense it was comming and then just belt. I always had to sit in college with someone between me and the door, becuase I ran one time, straight into the road. So maybe it was external, or maybe I just wanted to take this loop off?

And I do think you're a loonie pet, not becuase you want to experience something, that is perfectly natural, but you are def loonie, in the very best ways!

Q

LOL Diggin' your style there hon.



He described it as, if you moved even a fraction, it was like some atomic reaction going off through every cell in his head - excruciating, just had to lie down and not move.



You can't leave it at that! You have to tell me what lol



Wooow. This really is entering the realms of shamanism. I'm going to go pester my friend and find out what those books were. Tough one huh - did your nana ever stroke your hair to comfort you when it happened as a child? That's the most obvious explanation but then physical memory and spirit are so intertwined. Smells are often the precursors or accompaniments to spirit interaction - Spiritualists are constantly describing such events. I remember as a child I used to have a spirit who would come play with me and he was always preceded by a strong smell of oranges. The smell of a loved one's clothes after they've died often brings up huge emotions and memories which, in turn, can often lead to an interaction. I think we're often too obsessed about categorising things as 'material/rational' and 'spiritual/irrational' the interplay between the two is a constant.

Will def. try and get a reading list out of my mate and post it up.



Any idea why it stopped?



Bloody hell. Quite an achievement! I'm guessing that meant you weren't going out/to school/seeing friends much whilst that was going on? What sort of age were you? I'm guessing when it's happening that much there's just no pattern to it - couldn't plot it to do with hormones/periods/moon cycles/diet etc?



Woooow. That's an interesting reaction. Trying to physically outrun a mental/spiritual entity. I had an interesting progression with my migraines sort of like that but not. I used to get the paralysis and auric stuff come on, then it would go away after about half an hour or so and I’d be fine, then 3-4 hours later WHAM, it'd hit me with the full force of the pain. I remember a couple of occasions, after the auric side wore off (most notably once in school when they took me to the nurs' office because I said 'I’m going to have a migraine. I need to go home NOW.') when I just had this sinking sense of doom. I knew what was coming and I knew roughly how long I’d got, so I’d just burst into tears and cry, once to the point of hysteria, because I felt totally helpless and I knew that the pain was going to be utterly immense and there was nothing anybody could do about it until the doctor came with his little white pills. Twice they wanted to admit me to hospital fearing I had meningitis but my mum (and later my partner) just told them what it was and to medicate me and leave me be. It was this complete sense of 'I cannot go through this again'. Then the last time it happened, which was the first time I had only the auric migraine without the pain, the symptoms came on and I thought 'oh, sh!t'. But I didn't panic. I went upstairs, sat down, focused on remaining calm and thought about what I could do that might make a difference. It sounds really strange but it's like I 'met' my illness half-way, like I looked into it's eyes and asked 'what are you'. I could sense what it was. I can't remember exactly what I did - I know I drank water and ate something, then went to sleep for an hour or two thinking I’d wake up in the throws of pain. But I didn't. I woke up feeling slightly post-migraine woozy but no pain at all. The visual hallucinations had been much stronger than I'd had before (like the first lift of a psilocybin rush - the breathing fascination, the numbness, the heightened colours and physical detachment) and it's like the migraine took on a form that I could interact with for the first time ever. Very strange experience. I don't know whether I’ll ever have another one (they happen every 3-4 years so who knows) or whether I’ll avoid the pain again, but I can't help thinking that I’d managed to off-set the pain somehow through this interaction.



LOL A healthy lunatic Takes one to know one

Best wishes,

Marion.

Right, well, the suggestion seems to be:

"The shamanism one would be Roger Walsh's Spirit of Shamanism. Fucking excellent. It's in there (I think) where the epilepsy and shamanism stuff's talked about. Aswell as Holger Kalweit's Dreamtime and Inner Space. (Kalweit's done a few on the subject and if you get them, they're all worthwile)."

I'm getting the first one so i'll let you know if it's in there (read the first half, not the second so want to finish it lol) - the second I have no idea and, with my list as long as my arm at the moment, not likely to go through it any time soon. If you do get this and find anything, let me know and I'll move it up a couple of places

Best wishes,

Marion.

Cheers babe!

Q

Hi

Such an interesting discussion, thanks for sharing I`ll be looking up the books too, my eldest daughter (12) has active epilepsy and also has the most amazingly vivid dreams, as well as lots of lucid dreams. She will be really interested to find out about this x

social recoil? if someone has a problem with how another looks isn't it their own problem rather than the others? I met a woman a while ago at a party and something just want 'right' with her, I realised later on she had no facial hair at all, not even the wee fine blonde hairs which protect your skin. It found it a bit weird tbh


in the west perhaps but not across the world

You'd be surprised at the number of people who leave body hair alone, if you think about it it's the natural state so why mess with it? social conditioning? and who make sall the money from all the 'beauty products'? It's big business.

Heehee. I was looking for the other thread on body hair but could only find this one.

It is quite funny how quickly habits change. Take away my bath and my shower, give me a bucket of cold water, and all of a sudden - tadah! - I couldn't give a sh!t about leg hair lol

All the bits of me that get special grooming attention have had to fend for themselves recently - except my armpits, just because they're in such a convenient place that I wash each day - well, most days, when the water's on.


****Divine Intervention******

Amazing!

I was prompted to write the above because my water's been off again for two days. No sooner did I type it then the heavens opened major style - serious downpour. I grabbed my soap and my hairbrush, stripped off and leapt outside to have a shower in the run-off from my thatched roof

And guess what, I even shaved me pits

Aaaah god I feel better, I was wondering when I was ever going to get a wash again. Now if only it would rain hard enough to flush my loo I'd be sorted

I haven't had hot water in over two months now and I'll say one thing for my situation - my skin and my hair have never been healthier or softer in my life.

As for shaving or not - yes, it’s largely social conditioning. But, like make-up, perfume, jewellery, wearing the occasional dress - I like it. And if I like it, that's good enough for me. And Skaya - what you say about social recoil is correct, and that's what the article is saying. You'd probably like it.

God bless you goddess of rain, you have made me clean - my body if not my thoughts And gods of plumbing and piping, for feck's sake, get yer act together!

Same reason I shave my beard off, probably; personal preference and to appeal to the opposite sex whose tastes just go that way.

Stubble rash, from blokes, is awful *shudder*

'Specially on the insides of the legs, I'd imagine...

If you're a girl with body hair like a man it's not easy to live with.
I don't care if it's natural or not, frankly it's not natural for me to grow a beard. I loathe body hair, well mine anyway, not bothered about it either way on a man although I've never been up close and personal with one of either extreme.
I've got polycystic ovary syndrome and noe of the side-effects is huge amounts of hair growth. Y'know how waxing is supposed to remove hair for "up to 4 weeks"? Not a bloody chance mate. A week maybe is all I get.
You can get boob jobs and nose jobs on the NHS if you convince them it's upsetting your mental state, but will anyone give me laser treatment? Baaah humbug.
Mind you my brother looks like a carpet so maybe it's a family thing as well...
BM
xx