Hi
I haven't posted for a while, but an email from my sister made we wonder what other people thought about this scenario.
My sister has just been taken on in a doctors surgery. Now this doctor practises Reiki, and apparently he and his staff are really lovely. My sister is pagan, rather shamanic in her path.
She asked a good friend (recently catholic) for a character reference, and recieved this text back

"Mel you are a dear friend, but knowing what I know about Reiki, I cannot advise you to work for such a man. You may never be able to understand what I am (bit missing) r him and will be putting you in a position of danger. Basically your friends and sister will tell you it's all harmless and I am talking a load of crap. They will tell you what makes you and them feel ok, but not the awful truth. My advice is don't work for such people, they lead all souls to Hell. If you don't believe in the eternal soul or Hell then what can I do? Ask your Dad about such things. He is a good man and you are very blessed to have him as a father. He believes in God. He knows about the Saints. He is everything a husband and father should be. Look up dangers of Reiki on the internet and open your eyes. If you ever need anything you know where I am."

My sister was rather non-commital in her reply, and then recieved this one

"Dear Mel don't forget to look at warnings about Reiki on internet. Knowledge will protect you. Remember when you 'blocked' Margaret who did psychic reading in caravan - you were right to be wary, but both myself and Wendy (ME!)got you more interested in the new age. We have wronged you and I am so sorry for ever having made it seem like a good thing. Knowing what I know now, I am ashamed to have done such a thing. You deserve better. I know you are a lovely and caring person. I will say no more on the subject now. It's up to you to look into stuff now. Remember, I am always here if you need me, day or night. Love Anne"

This Anne has monks and nuns visit her house constantly after making friends with someone who had been 'possessed by a demon', and was instrumental in his exorcism.She attends every mass, and threw out all her 'evil' stuff, even music like Clannad!!

Opinions please on just WTF is going on here?? In this day and age, can catholics instill such fear into people? It is a sobering thought that a former friend would lead a witch hunt against me if she were able.

Thanks for reading

Poppy

This is fundamentalist Christianity speaking. It's not confined to Catholicism.

Remember, you are damned!

In short reply to this .......

Thank you... my thoughts exactly lol

Very disturbing that she appears to have been brainwashed to such an extent. I'd be more worried about her safety than your sister's.

Any religion can inspire fundamentalism - Paganism included.

And recent converts do tend to be more evangelical than old-hands.

Your friend's attitude isn't really *that* unusual. She's saying what she's been taught and what seems right to her.

There's no right or wrong way to deal with this kind of situation, only the way that leaves you knowing that you acted honourably and with dignity. With any luck the friend will practice tolerance and "live-and-let-live" - if not then there may have to be some very uncomfortable decisions to make re your friendship

Sorry, I think Ann has had a pretty sad life, I suspect she has suddenly had an enourmous boost to her Ego, with the Exorcism and currently feels she is Gods right hand woman!
I think there has been a big 'Shift' in her world (sudden mid life crisis type thing), that has been brewing quietly for years.
I suspect after a while it will all end in tears and some other issues like a divorce will surface.
But at the moment I'd stay away, she would just try and Exorcise your Pagan Demons!
Give it time and when it all comes to the Surface, she will need a real friend, when all the short term excitement is over! Be there then!
Id call it temporary insanity, but Fundamentalist would also do.
Sorry!

I don't even think it's fundamentalist christians. It's NEW christians. You'll see the same thing happen with new pagans (new buddhists and hindus too probably). The fundamentalists are the ones who don't stop being new. I mean look at all the weirdos in the paganism. Excessve everything, everything natural is good, everything christain is evil (they stole our festivals) and then slowly it settles down when the novelty wears off. It's just that we don't notice their fundamentalism so much because it's in our direction.
Some of them go on to becoming balanced people some don't. So i wouldn't worry about it. Anything that is 'alternative' is bound to get some grief simply because it is alternative and therefore has an element of the unknown to it.

edit. jeez. pomona got in bfore me. but i'll leave mine anyway.

Dear Woozle,



Thank you! That's a brilliant way of putting it. I wish I'd said that.

I probably will in future....

BB,

John Macintyre

your former friend seems to be in a very strange place - i could only say ignore her & don't let her affect either your life or your sisters

I'd just avoid her if i was you

If you think thats bad, i live 3 doors away from a centeral gehova witness church. They knock the door and talk you to death. They tell me that being pagan is wrong, i keep them talking n talking making them think theve got me and i then say.. 'well that made to sense at all, and so now as a pagan im gonna go"

yet they still come back... if its not the gehovas its the catholic nuns asking for youth to come to sunday school.

ive always belived that you are what you are and you can be what ever you want to be. As long as your true to yourself you can achieve anything.

To achieve something, youve got to try something new.

Daniel, just tell them you are 'Gay!' they wont bother you again!

But for goodness sake, don't tell them you like small boys - otherwise they'll have you in a cassock quicker than you can say "Suffer the little children"!

Frankly, it doesn't matter what their religious pretenses, this "good friend" has obviously been brainwashed by them to indoctrinate others. This leaves only two options- either your sister dump the friend or be prepared to call in a professional deprogrammer. Exorcism groups tend to be a fanatical breed of their own.

I'd advise kidnapping the Catholic friend and deprogramming her, you know, like in the Simpsons...

Here, check out these articles:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-50...-war-Satan.html

http://www.theisticsatanism.com/asp/exorcism.html

http://www.ewtn.com/library/CURIA/CDFEXORC.htm

A little bit of info on how it came about in the first place.....

I went to stay with my sister over the christmas holiday period, and on boxing day we went to a party at the friends. (Anne)
Anne told me about this guy she had befriended who was seeing disembodied legs in his bedroom. She and her husband were quite worried about him, and asked my advice. (In what capacity I really don't know!!) They insisted that he was possessed. At this point, Anne was not religious at all. She had various bits and bobs around her home from buddha to hag stones, but her tendency to believe all conspiracy theories was a tad suspect in retrospect.
My dad, the 'good man who believes in the saints' she refers to, kept out of this conversation on possession. A relapsed catholic, he hasn't been a church in over 50 years!!
My first suggestion was a doctor!! I considered that maybe ruling out an illness would be prudent. I then suggested the spiritualist church , but she didn't feel they could help this guy. Clutching at straws I suggested they go and see a priest if they were convinced of this phenomena. I did NOT want to have the conversation at all to be frank. I expressed doubt that the man in question was indeed possessed.

Well, Anne did not just go to a priest, she went to the local monastery. A monk visited her at home and warned her of the evils of the world etc. They brought this young man to Anne's home and carried out the exorcism there. Suddenly everything went wrong in her house, things fell off tables, there were knocks and bangs and footsteps. They saw dark shapes in corners. The monks had to then come and cleanse her house, telling her that her only protection was in devout christianity.
On it went from there... and as you can see from the texts that she sent my sister, the monks did a good job!

I am completely barred from emailing her, visiting etc. Its my sister she is concerned for as she feels I led her down the path of evil. I just don't like the idea that she may try to indoctrinate my sister, although I would hope my sister had more sense.

Interesting that this sort of thing can occur in this day and age in Britain ....

Thanks for that...I will email those links to my sister

There's not much that I can add to what the others have already said.

After reading that letter, I would be more worried about this Anne than the dangerous warnings that she was trying to instill!

I've just read the added bit:




It's not surprising that the monks went through that whole scenario, it's getting more difficult to brainwash people today and it is worrying.

A small word of warning- fundies can be prone to causing trouble, it might be best for your sis to try cut contact with this woman for a while. A friend of mine became a rabid (and I do mean rabid, practically foaming at the mouth!) JW a few years back. For mine and my kids safety he spoke to elders at the JH headquarters about us and we recieved numerous visits. They told me they had links in the Social Services and police and felt that our children may need intervention! I was so bloody angry I can't tell you. I spoke to the friend (who has since woken up and is now a lovely godless fella again!) and told him to call them off. Just be careful, if these people decide to 'help' it can get extremely messy.

Celticstar, my suggestion would have been to make a note of the dates and times of their visits and make to a formal request to the headquarters that they leave you alone or you'd have them charged with harassment and threatening behaviour. Because what they said about having links to the police and social services, etc is threatening behaviour and I'm sure that neither the police or a judge would take kindly to that.

I'd suggest being careful around this person and agree with Celticstar that some of the more evangelical/fundamentalist types can be prone to causing trouble.

Storm Raven

Never thought of that! I was just panic stricken and very very angry! It is a major problem when a person becomes so fervent in their beliefs that it overrides common sense and established relationships, and is a tricky one to handle.

that sounds extremely odd. In the Catholic sense, I mean - monasteries are usually part of an established religious order which is governed by rules designed to introduce checks and balances to ensure no one goes off the rails. From what you say, these have failed in a fairly spectacular fashion.

In the same way the SR recommended to Celticstar that persistent offenders (so to speak!) could be reported up the chain of the religion, so monks behaving in this fashion can be reported to the leading 'house' of the order.

I have to say though - I wonder if this is a regular order at all, or whether it's a one-off monastery "under private ownership".

Yeah. It makes me wonder an all. Exorsisms are not carried out lightly. Yet this Order seems to have charged in. Seems Very Odd to me ?

Don't take this the wrong way please, but have you actually SEEN these monks etc? I ask because she could be fabricating the entire thing - for whatever reasons.

Actually Tas, no I haven't seen them. I really don't believe she would fabricate the whole thing though. She certainly seemed very earnest when she asked for my advice at christmas regarding the "possession".

I don't know the exact details, but she went to them, its apparently quite an open order, and there were nuns there too. Re a pm, I did wonder if the priest from the order carried out the actual exorcism. However, these monks were present according to Anne.

If she is making it up, for whatever purpose, I would be very seriously worried about the state of her mental health.

I wonder if anyone can find this order?? She lives near Holywell in Wales....

dont you just love them gehovas that is not small boys

Urm, I *think* Tas meant the Catholics

Not having heard much about Jehovah's and small boys

There's a Fransican order at Pantsaph, near Holywell. First order Anglican Fransicans can be mixed friaries (men and women). I don't know whether the Catholic Fransicans permit such things.

I can't find any more info online about the Friary.

Regarding the RC church and exorcisms, I found this from Wiki:



Priests are usually trained specifically for this.

Then I found some similar stories of monks performing such rituals :
Monks help banish demons



Exorcism on the rise in Europe

Good grief!! I am amazed by how this type of thing is on the increase. Are there more people suddenly believing in demonic possession, or are the churches playing this for all its worth?

I blame Living TV and the Exorcist programme and the other Most Haunted, etc type rubbish!

Oh yes, I saw one of those where the participants were egging on the 'entity' to come and get them if it dare. If I were an entity, I would wait till no one was looking then give them a shock they would never forget!!

That's another thing I love about that programme - in addition to the magnificent Derek Akorah, obviously - they all stand around going "If there's anyone there, please, please make contact with us. We're not here to harm you" etc and then when there's a tap or a noise they all scream and run away. Rather like someone ringing your doorbell and then screeching "FUCK !! FUUUCCKK!!" and legging it off down the road when you answer it. Most perplexing for the entities I would have thought

PMSL!!! I always thought that too!
Surely that is the purpose they are there for, so why so surprised/frightened ?

Whitethorn

The last time I visited the Pantasaph Friary, the monks there were Capuchin Franciscan Friars (a male only religious order). They have close links to the St Winefride's Pilgrims Rest (Guest house) run by Bridgettine Sisters in Holywell.

of course the crucifx would need changed as we are talking re JWs!
damn can't find a smilie of an upright stake!

Now that sounds like Catholic Franciscans to me. And I can't recall there being an Anglican Franciscan establishment out there, anyway.

But in post #27 Starpoppy said :


That suggests it can't be Pantasaph Friary, and I can't find anything else online.

Thanks, Pasher - from the little I did see about the Friary online it didn't come across to me as a hotbed of religious silly ideas.

I was told there were nuns there, but it is possible that they were visiting?? As I said, I am not sure of exact details about the monastery because she no longer speaks to me. There were nuns involved somewhere