I while ago, a long while ago. I mentioned about when I sometimes go into deep meditation its as if I am seeing through my eyes, but there is another layer behind my skin and i'm sort of wearing this human face as a mask of my real face.

It is a very weird feeling and one that is hard to describe if you haven't experienced it before. But the thing that I am seeing or that appears to be me is very bestial and quite scary and I sometimes have to force myself out of the trance its so disquietening.

Anyway, after trawling the net for some pics of Herne and Cernunnous (little project at the mo) I came across the attached piccie.

This is the closest I have seen a picture get to seeing what I see, though the version I see is a bit more savage as the teeth are there (pointy and cat-like) and its always angry, snarling and such.

Anyways, thought I would share as it was kind of odd to see this picture staring back at me.

Question now is.... what does it all mean!?

I had a similar experience many years ago meditating by looking at my own face in a mirror. It was so horrible that I never did it again so can't really offer any insight. I'd be intrigued to know what everyone else makes of it though.

Just means you are seeing your ugly self as you really are PaganBoy, nothing to worry about, it is not alien possesion. Work hard through a few lifetimes and you will turn into a pretty boy with clear skin and shining eyes, oh and a halo. Next time look at your wings, that is exciting.

The idea of 'horrible' comes just from your own fear Snip, not of what you saw but of the change in perception. It is worth exploring further as this is a fun way into trance and magick and certainly reveals things about the real world around you that can be interesting. Once you get past fear and or revulsion that is.

I should add, it is well worth going past the fear and or revulsion/horror. Took me a few times but I finally got the ability to see the whole world like that, as what it is, a hellish plane of nasty creatures grovelling in their own shit and made ugly by their own base instincts and lust for power and self. Oh, yeah, that includes those closest to us, our lovers and parents and friends, it also includes us!

But also, you can use that ability to see the magick, the light and the beauty. That may take a while to get to, as we often tend toward fear and darkness with new stuff like this. Now that new vision, for example when you and your lover are joined and clothed in light, if you ever get there, is worth all the fear and so on on the way. And also, if you get to that point, you will find you have the ability to take others there.

Its just witchcraft.

'PaganBoy' meet 'PaganBoy Shadow'

*nods*

It's one of the reasons I like working when there's no moon - because then you have to really *see* things properly and you can see them for what they really are

Now thats interesting you say that because whenever I do go out I have this feeling of something lurking behind me just out of sight that I can never actually see as when I turn round it runs.

I've sort of got used to it over the years, but it is definately like having a shadow following you...

Ugly - spiritually, physically, mentally, or all three?

I don't necessarily think that it is "ugly" just more beastial and primitive. I don't want shiny halo's and such (have you seen the prices of halo polish lately!).

I have this statue/carving that I think is pretty awesome and it would be great to actually be like that, weird as I am. But its very feral and I sort of like that look.

Well I was being 'tongue in cheek' (as opposed to other places mentioned elsewhere), about the ugliness. This way of seeing is quite well known amongst witches and once you get used to it, it can be a good 'tell' about people especially as you see the subtle changes when dealing with them. The eyes will add to it as to whether they are 'witch' on top of it all.

Don't forget there is not really any 'good' or 'bad' type of morality amongst real witches, so the sight you use is to reveal inner nature, the judgement is then up to you, and your relationship with them.

I reckon you just have an ordinary dose of growing psychic ability to use and shape as you will. If you push it too much to the sense of 'lurking behind you', 'shadow' and so on then you are shaping it toward darkness however much you do it from fun. That is not necessarily a bad thing and is your choice but I just repeat that it is probably worthwhile looking at the light and shiny stuff too. Its about learning broad awareness rather than taking a position in any spectrum of behaviour or stylistic fantasy.

Don't forget to look for your wings.

Cool statue of Aardhu that, can you PM me where you found it please?.

I think what frightened me was that it happened instantly. I don't mean as soon as I began - I'd been there a fair while - but when it did happen it was like throwing a switch. I was quite young and not a Pagan when it happened, whereas now I've more experience of meditation. I had another experience when I first started to learn meditate where I felt an huge suffusion of energy from my arse right to the roots of my hair. It felt for a few seconds like my head was on fire and I actually put my hand up to feel. Someone told me that it was my Chakras opening but I'm not sure

Maybe I'll have another go at the mirror thing and see if anything happens, and if so if I can control it better

Cool Statue!

I didnt actually mean it was a Shadow following you, I meant it was your Inner Dark Self! Your Shadow Self, the dark aspects of your Subconscious, that bit we all have that we are not to happy about, fear, because it scares us a bit, the bit most of us (Humans) ignore and spend their lives running from, busy, busy!

But it also interests us, its a bit like sex, it isnt spoken about all the time, but its always on your mind, titillating and tempting you! Its that side of us, that we dont generally show the world, the bit that roars up and thumps people when your friends and loved ones are threatened!
Its often externalised when first encountered, its feels safer to be seperate!
The Inner Beast or Hunter!
It is a good friend to have and something we must all become comfortable with, if we are to progress!

would go with the general opinion about the 'darker side of the self', I sometimes see a scarred face on mine - sometimes a black face (african negro). I get others too. My BF gets a demon like face.

fizz.

Oddly enough, I discovered at first hand the meaning of the saying "to be beside one's self with rage" only a few weeks back. Whilst at the E & A dept yet again with my daughter, the surgeon asked me my views about her long drawn out recovery (coffs - a recovery from a wound that took almost TEN months!?).

Cue Tas to have the red mist descend. Cue Tas to also take a very deep breath and think about the consequences in the longer term (jail for GBH?) should she say what she REALLY feels...

At which point, I became totally detached, was aware of the "other me" standing outside and to my right, as I very calmly and politely explained my views. The poor man stepped back and went white, and I am sure my face /eyes must have changed/conveyed the inner rage/sent it outwards. To say the wheels were set in motion is putting it mildly!

My daughter was whipped upstairs and had another op to rectify the original balls up. By the afternoon she was well on the road to recovery. So yes, the "other" does have a place - though one best kept only for dire need IMO.

Hi Pagan boy and Snippety

I actually dont think you should be scared of this at all. To me as human being its important to understand both the positive and negative sides of our character. Without this understanding and acknowledgement then you cannot be in balance.

I welcomed my darkness with open arms and felt a deep sense of relief that I no longer had to strive for perfection. That it was ok to be human and that as a human we cannot always be "love and light"

But with Witchcraft I think its even more necessary. Balance is imperitive. As has been said, Witchcraft is neither black nor white so to have any success, then in my opinion, you have to acknowledge, and be able to "work" with, all aspects of self.

Pomona, I also prefer to work by dark of moon. There is then no shadow (or light) except that which you "see"

The statue came from a shop in Brighton. They do a "goddess" version but I am not so keen on that one.

Was it Hocus Pocus / Bell Book & Candle ? I miss browsing round there. I know you can online but it isn't the same Not much I miss about Brighton though, to be honest !

Thanks for your reply too Comfrey - I'm definitely going to have another go when I get a spare minute and see if I can't learn something

Rudolph Steiner talked about the 'Guardian of the Threshold', which I think is the same thing as you are all talking about, the dark or shadow side of oneself.

Steiner said that the Guardian is a terrifying being because its function is to keep out of your awareness all the things about yourself that you can't bear to know. Only when you are strong enough to face the Guardian and accept the dark aspects of yourself, are you fit to cross the threshold into higher worlds.

Actually, now I'm thinking about it again after having drifted away from Steiner, it seems a bit like hokum. People do surely travel into higher vibrational worlds without necessarily encountering a Guardian character.

Julai the Guardian idea is one I am very familiar with, there is that which stands sometimes between me and the Dark. It (for it is sexless and timeless) scares the crap out of me whenever I do any "inner" work. But... it is not a barrier. More a... warning perhaps that care must be taken from this point on. It can be faced and even overcome. There is an interesting Meditation involving Merlin introducing you to your greatest fear, that works along a very similar line. If you can face the fear/Guardian you emerge stronger/wiser.

(Wish I could answer two replies at the same time Eth - sorry!)

Re Steiner and keeping out one's awarenesses - I have realised that the cancer I have has fulfilled that very function. Odd, yes. But it's a living thing trying to survive, and regarded generally as a parasite because it is draining my body of its life. Yet it has a reason for being too.
I reckon my life has been so stressed I haven't had/taken time to take stock/breath. And the cancer has filled the need in order to force me to slow down.
I also think it is a part of unresolved issues from way back when. OK this may sound like self-obsessed, nutty rambling, and a desperate attempt to rationalise one of our deepest fears: mortality. But it's a queer old world. "Be afraid of what you ask for" is a good adage. I begged for respite. Now it's being enforced - well, as long as I fancy staying alive that is!

The alter ego, the Doppleganger notion - surely Quasi will come in on this one(?) rings bells too.

I think I maybe have to do some more thinking on this one, but your words have resonated - both Julai and Eth. (& Eth - I mean your blog here too BTW.)

I think I am my Guardian. I'm not sure where the other guy went...

Sounds about right to me Inverurie Jones!

the statue of cernunnos is by a guy called neil sims. He has also done one of the morrighan and also another goddess. These sometimes crop up on ebay - I have the tee shirt. As for the meditation(?) image, I agree, it's the shadow self, ones repressed anger, hatred and fears, aka the guardian of the threshold. I usually take it as a good sign, once it comes thru in meditation, it means you have no choice but to go past it and on to better things!