I know this is a bit of a personal question but what would people suggest if you feel like you have started to lose faith / belief?

Sorry to be brief.

How about taking some time to think over things? Take a few armchair evenings, or long country walks if that's where you do your thinking.

Not all belief is good, and not all belief is necessary.

You might find it helps to write a journal - letters to yourself, if you like - thrashing out exactly where you are and where you want to get to.

I can't add much to what Fred has suggested.

We sometimes get glitches for a reason though - can you pinpoint anything that's happened that might have triggered this? Maybe there is a message for you?

Think about what made you believe in the first place and what has changed since then.

Sometimes going back to basics or beginnings can help.

Consider what drew you to you path / faith in the first place, what gave you the wonder and interest then? Does it still hold that wonder?

Compare where you were then and where you have traveled / got to now. See the progress. You can be surprised at how much you have discovered, how much you have learned and you can reflect on that and consider the sucesses and places where your faith seemed very close and real.

Also accept that everyone has moments in thier life where the doubt / loose faith / feel sluggish and out of sorts. This doese not nessecerily mean that it is all over or that you should radically change your POV, think of it more like a dorment time like winter to rest, consolidate and recoperate before a new spring.

As others have posted, long thought filled walks, quiet time and reflective writeing or just chatting things through with yourself, the world and the Gods can be helpful ways of mulling over the thoughts you are having and the questions that come up.

Be bright,bebold
Fillionous

Hi sethandra, I think everything that has been said so far is very helpful, can,t really add much accept to say I think it happens I think it needs to happen to sharpen things up a bit so that we don,t become too complacent and stop noticing things and questioning things and enjoying things,and perhaps re-focus you know, its a growth thing , we grow , so naturally our belief and faith will grow as well but not necessarily in the way that you might have expected.Does that make any sense? Sorry, felt I needed to try and answer but this has come out as complete sh*te

MM08

I actually think it depends on what you are loosing your fain in.

If you are doubting the path you are on, for example if you are wiccan or heathen or xtain... then its less likely to be about the principals of those faiths and more about the gods or "magic" within it.

I think it would try and work that out first. Try and analyse that. Are your gods no longer speaking to you or do you no longer believe that they ever did. What is it that you are loosing faith with. I think from there, at least you can say, ok, these are the aspects that are troubling me and it makes it far easier to find a way forward from there.

Hope that makes sense.

Are you losing your spirituality or losing your religion? They're two entirely different things IMO. I've lost my religion before now, but not my spirituality. Though I had to let go and wait (for years, actually), I ended up changing religion my attitude towards gods and how I approach the whole question of something beyond Midearth (this world) remained fundamentally the same.

OTOH, if you're losing your spirituality then you may feel you're sliding towards no faith of any kind. That's a different question, but we have many atheist pagans here who can talk about what a pagan life without gods and religion is like.

I'm in a bit of a spiritual flux at the moment. I feel like I'm being led away from my theistic Norse path to a broader more general Pagan view of things. I have started to question my need for some of the beliefs I have and try to analyse my motives.

In short I am wondering if the Norse path I have been following with its deities, 9 Virtues, Thorshammer etc has been easier for me to cling to because it has similarities with the christianity I was brought up with (a written history, a symbol, a code of conduct, deity/ies for example) and because I find it easier to explain to other non-Pagans than a vague humanist approach. I am beginning to feel trapped and stifled by the limitations I perceive and to wonder if I should be broadening my horizons to a more eclectic/atheist/humanist path.

Otoh I am scared of leaving the familiar behind and ceasing to perform the practices I have been doing for nearly 7 years. I am frightened that divine retribution will affect my family if I cease to honour the Gods, yet annoyed with myself for what seems to be superstitious thinking. In particular I worry that my son, during whose conception, gestation and birth I called on the Gods for help, would be taken from me in some way. I know this is irrational and probably a hangover from school taught christianity - the sort of "Jesus can even see you on the lav" nonsense I mean.

I am trying to resolve this inner conflict as best I can by reading a lot, trying to meditate (not easy with a babyn), and endless talking things through with my hubby (who will not encourage me either way). I also get a lot out of coming here and reading the experiences of others. Until I came here I'd never heard of atheist Pagans I don't feel like I'm losing anything as such, just that I'm on the brink of a great change of sorts. It feels like I can't go back now to how I've felt about my path previously. I feel like when people go to release something into the wild and the creature cowers in the cage. Hard to describe, unsettling and strange.

...sorry i feel like I'm hijacking this totally now, but I can't stop !

In a recent conversation with Mr S he said that for him any Gods were just masks that bits of his sub-conscious wore to deal with is rational brain and that maybe I was now spiritually mature enough to recognise myself behind the mask and take full control and responsibility for my spiritual life. Like taking the stabilisers off

Coming to this forum has changed the way I see things firstly because of the Heathens. I've read here eloquent posts about how people relate to their Gods and Wights and how they communicate. I have never had that kind of experience, nor had any real kind of spiritual journeying. Any experience I have had could be put down to imagination and my own brain as suspected by Mr S. So I somehow doubt that this is my true path. Secondly because of encountering Pagan humanists and atheists which I didn't even know was a valid "option".

Has anyone else bee through anything like this ? Is it a loss of faith or am I just crazy ?

(Sorry for hijacking OP but I'm finding this whole thing quite distressing. your post has helped me to voice my feelings so thanks )

You say that as though it's a bad thing Or at least as though it is somehow your fault . Doubt is a very natural thing and very useful tool for refining and defining ideas when trying to make sense of the world - whether the latter can ever be fully achieved is another matter.

Seriously, does the possibility that there might not be any gods or defined purpose make the universe a less wondrous and awe inspiring place? We are still part of it, minor role or not.

Read "Dark Night of the Soul" by St. John of the Cross. Once you get over the Christian references and start mentally changing those to suit your own beliefs, then there is a lot of wisdom in there.

I have come to view what is often called the 'dark night of the soul' as a time when the soul retreats from the body for healing and recuperation. That is why we feel distant from whatever it is we hold sacred, because our soul, the part of us that makes the connection, is more distant from our conscious selves and therefore less easy to connect with. For most people, this distancing of the soul is temporary and our faith and belief returns, often when we least expect it.

Rhiannon

I think my soul has been distant from me for about 35 years. I'm terrified to let it back in in case I become a xtian. That's the thing that's worried me most for nearly all my life.
BM
xx

I know many pagans who use the winter to 'draw in' and think about their goals and expectations. I know I seem to have a tiny crisis of faith around this time (although not necessarily about religion!)

Snippety hon,

I think Mr. S had some wise words for you IMO

I don't think anyone should live in fear of their path or indeed, their doubts about a path etc. If something no longer 'sits well' with you, then maybe it's time to move on a bit in your journey. Nobodys saying that what went before was wrong.. you were in a place you needed to be at the time, now your needs have changed - see what's next around the corner for you. I personally, don't give the whole retribution thing a second thought. If something you believed in at a specific point in your life, gave you a sense of guidance and protection, that entity isn't somehow now going to bite you on the arse for thinking a little differently....

Take time out.. look inside your self, trust your gutt and just go with the flow, most of all, I'd say.. never live in fear

And no.. your not crazy.. It's called thinking for yourself and there's nowt wrong with that

Barnx

Faith is like a reflection of mother earth herself, it goes through seasons, and just like the seasons there are times of change, times of development and times when we just stand still. I find often my spiritual seasons do closely follow those of the earth.

In the course of my life I have managed to believe loads of things which now I find I no longer have the motivation to believe in. To my mind, the most important thing to hold on to is a belief in yourself - that you can achieve, that you are a worthwhile person, etc.

Other beliefs, well it's really sad that I've lost interest in communion with God or gods/goddesses, mainly because they don't seem to be there for me and other things have begun to seem more interesting to pursue.

The reason it's sad is that working within a belief system gives you nice feelings of belonging and a direction to pretend to be following. Once you let go of that, you can pay lip-service for a bit, but it doesn't feel the same.

I don't think there's much you can do about it though. It just happens. Perspectives change.

Thanks for those wise replies. It's been really helpful expressing these feelings. I think I'm going to have a time of quiet reflection over the winter and see how I feel come Ostara. April is a time we have, as a family, set for other goals and it feels like this is a time for gestation and just letting things sit for a while.

I do feel sad because the Norse path is something which has held my interest and devotion since childhood. As Mr S points out, if I move away from that I don't have to stop reading sagas, or learning more about the Runes, but it feels like a betrayal to explore other paths. I am also wondering if it is related to the fact that since I became a mother I'm finally getting over my disastrous relationship with my parents, and leaving my childhood anxieties and crutches behind.

Anyhoo enough of my maunderings. Many thanks to all

You can still be an Atheist and Heathen Snippety...there are plenty about who consider the social values, the things such as fate and ancestors, the land and wights to be more important than deities. After all, and what people often forget about Heathenry when they get carried away with subconciously Christianizing Heathen Gods, is that Heathenry is better expressed as a worldview rather than a religion. Not all people from 'Heathen' times believed in the Gods however they still had what was considered a Heathen worldview.

I know you feel like you are losing something when it comes to the Heathen stuff but try not to see it like that. See this crisis as a blessing, a time to question and go along with it. What would Odin do at a time like this? He'd go with the knowledge and see where it took him. Learn, grow and if you come out of this as an atheist or with your faith renewed then try to accept it. Things happen for a reason. It will have been your luck for that to happen.

It's not an all or nothing thing, we are all individuals and our paths do not need uniformity. There is no uniformity of belief in pre-Christian Northern Europe and this idea of a collective belief as Heathens, the Nine noble virtues, things like the hammer rite do owe more to Christian ideas about religion than actual Heathen Worldview.

In my opinion, the 'keystones' of being a Heathen are:

* A belief in luck/hamingja.
In the sagas, luck can be both personal and shared with family/communities you belong to. Our actions can either cause a loss of luck or a gain of luck and in turn effect those you are connected to. A Heathen recognises and understands this and takes responsibility for his/her actions.

*Respect for your family and community.
By this, I mean not doing anything to adversely effect the shared luck of your group and communities and by extension the personal luck of the people involved with you. A Heathen would work for the benefit of those people.

*Respect and create good relationships with the local land wights.
Lack of respect for the land wights brings loss of luck and affects your community. During the Viking age and before, it was believed that angering the wights could have dire consequences and folks have been known in the lore to have been chased off their land by angry wights. As an interesting side note, the practice of Niding(a form of cursing) grew up around this belief. A horse's head and hide would be mounted on a pole and turned to face the home of person that the would-be curser wanted to curse. On the pole, grave insults would be carved. The Nidstang (the pole with the head on it) was believed to incite the contempt and hatred of the land wights and so it was believed that the wights would go after whoever was made a Niding.


* Honour your ancestors
Ancestor honour and worship is one of the oldest forms of pre-Christian belief.

I hope that helps.

That is helpful Elswyth. Thank you.

I do still feel the need for a structure and values....something a little more than "do what you will" I've tried to live by the Virtues for around 6 years now and see no reason to change that. That side of tings works for me and has, I believe, improved my life beyond measure. Your points about uniformity and world view are very interesting. I didn't realise one could be an atheist heathen either.

This forum is great for finding new perspectives and pointers. I think I've a lot to study and mull over in the coming months

Hi Sethandra, i wanted to help the but all i can do is tell u what happened to me when i felt like that...
i was brought up a cristian.. i didnt realise it was a religion as such- just taught it like the alphabet anyway.... i was 9 when my grandad died and i did the typical thing people do afta a tragady like that-i questioned my faith "if there was a god he would`nt have hurt a good man" so afta about a year i realised i wasnt a cristian which was hard. i spent many years thinking it was great haveing no religion, that my life was my responsibility... then i came across paganism and i felt "comfortable" i know losing faith the 1st time was for a good reason in the end. it is hard leaving old beliefs behind when they are drummed into you but you cant make youself believe something.

all the advice i can give really is give yourself time to work out WHY you may be losing faith as (i think) all things happen for a good reason...it just takes a while to see it some times. it took me 8/9 years to realise why i lost my faith..
hope i`v helped a little pixie xx

Sethandra, can I suggest you read Woozle's blog about Autumn?
(It's very thought provoking. )

Well hey chick, if you ever want to discuss Heathenry and have some help sorting the modern ideas from the actual lore, just drop me a PM.

I think you'll find it rather surprising

If I was ever to get into a path, it would be the Northern Tradition.

You'd make a brilliant Heathen!

FAITH
the word itself is in its essence unquantifiable. I always think of it a bit like stepping off the edge of a cliff and having to trust that there is some kind of invisible path you cant see that will stop you from falling (there's a scene a bit like it in lord of the rings! lol).

Every so often in our lives I think its normal to have "a wobble", a time when our faith is tested and we question much, so don't worry i'm guessing its happened to most of us. I've come to wonder if it is finding it again, or somehow finding it anyway in a situation where we could so easily fall that makes it all the more precious and if that is what makes it so sacred and ultimately Faith?

Just my wonderings.
BBs LL