Ok, first off, I'm just a newbie and I never posted on any boards before I came to The Valley so if this is presumptuous of me anyone should feel free to smack me upside the head and tell me to shut up. *hoping my cheeky grin will win people over like it does in face to face tense situations!*

I'm not a pagan. However, out of all the spiritual or religious paths I've seen paganism seemed to be the one to make the most sense which is why I'm interested in it now. As a person who came here to learn I found the first six of Odin's posts and the debates they sparked quite interesting. Seeing the for and against has been really educational.

Odin DAvalon, please could you post all your questions here and now. It seems to me that people are becoming frustrated with the questions. If they were all posted here then maybe people could take questions they felt qualified to answer and start a new thread, or not. Odin has said that he doesn't want to post his opinion, which is fine, but this way the topic could be debated and Odin wouldn't have to post unless he felt that his question wasn't being properly answered. As someone who's just starting to learn I'd quite like to see and hear everyone's point of view on a whole range of issues, most of which I'm sure I haven't even thought of before. Especially as these issues seem to centre on the validity of Paganism.

As a second issue (and maybe this needs to be another thread), all these questions seem to lead back to what is paganism. Is a totally new religion based on old myths? Does it mean anything and everything you want it to? Is it the re-emergence of ancient and sacred truths kept secret by a few awaiting the time for it to be common knowledge again?

Obviously, paganism can't be any spiritual path, otherwise it wouldn't be called paganism, it would be called anything. A person could say "My SUV is sacred and the corporation that made it is a God, and I worship that God, and that is my branch of paganism." I think most pagans would disagree with that. I'd always thought that pagansim covered any religion or spiritual path that respected the sanctity and power of nature as one of its core beliefs. Is this definition worng?

Hello Bertha,



I'm sorry but as I have shared, I am done with posting my research project questions on this site. Six questions was all it took to see regular posters take offense to my posting, and I've put an end to that situation having to take the time to author over a dozen replies to decently end uprising confrontations, and I have neither the time nor the desire to start it up again.

Posting the qeustions is easy, about 20 minutes of work each x 6 questions = 2 hours of invested time.

However, answering replies, and calming down uprising confrontations took hours of addition time, about 22 hours of work to deal with the aftermath from 2 hours of posting.

At this 10 hours of replies to 1 hours of posting, in doing the math that would be 999 hours of replies to 99 hours of posting. Sorry but I simply don't have the time to invest. And the energy. No thanks.





All good questions, and I'm sure that you will find good answers.





Well, I'd have to say that you have left behind the guible simplicity of accepting what is promoted as paganism, and that you are beginning to examine paganism for yourself as to reach your own conclusions.

Odin d'Avalon

Quote:

"Posting the qeustions is easy, about 20 minutes of work each x 6 questions = 2 hours of invested time.

However, answering replies, and calming down uprising confrontations took hours of addition time, about 22 hours of work to deal with the aftermath from 2 hours of posting.

At this 10 hours of replies to 1 hours of posting, in doing the math that would be 999 hours of replies to 99 hours of posting. Sorry but I simply don't have the time to invest. And the energy. No thanks. "



I think that I can safely say that most of The Valley residents have no set time limits on their "Paganism" and no limits to their commitment to their beliefs.

We are what we are 24/7.

I've never felt the need to "time" and justify my presence in the valley.

Odin..if you wanted to "research" the resources were in front of you all along embedded within the hundred of threads and topics raised since The Valley doors were opened and that you have been gently directed towards by several individuals during the course of the last few days.

Did you really want to perform "research" or just be told the answers?

What you do with your time is your business, what I've said is that my time if very valueable to me, and I don't have the time nor the desire to put into the conversation of another of my research question. Which is entirely my business without lectures from anyone as to what I do with my time.




I've read almost all of the materials posted on this site, I've read over 100 pagan books, and reference materials. The majority of what paganism promotes is IMO incorrect. And so NO the answer are not right in front of me, lots of opinions, but mostly just opinions promoting what was read in a book but an author that wrote fiction.

The answers that I received were not published on this site, nor in any pagan book. The closes truth found was from weatherwitch, that the core of paganism is diversity. However, I took that a step further, to understand that the diversity of paganism is not in organized religions, but in a paganism custom made by each pagan, to whatsoever a pagan so desires paganism to be. And that is not anywhere to be found right in front of me.

Even though, so much is incorrect, it is perfect for those using said materials because in paganism nobody is wrong. Therefore I say incorrect to history, to what mythology actually means, an allegorical narrative of a hidden meaning of spritual values. And although incorrect to my understanding, it is perfectly correct to anohter person.

Paganism is therefore also a movement where everybody is correct and nobody is wrong. Because even though something is wrong (like so many things about paganism are wrong to me) I nor anybody can say that to a pagan, hey stop that! That isn't paganism, or mythology isn't history, for paganism has reached a point for all pagans in 2004 where paganism now defies history, defies logic, and defies scholarly understandings and teaching and re-writes and re-creates meaning to establish words and issues. So as much as I know within my mind and soul that you are incorrect about a lot of issues, in paganism I concede that you are right about everything that you say, because that is paganism, perfect and without error from any pagan.

Therefore, I have learned in the last 36 hours to have two understanding, and to live in two separate worlds. (1) The world of my research, and (2) the pagan world were everythng is perfect because a pagan says so. That's just the way it is.

Odin d'Avalon

It's very late for me 2:27am and I will be typing with typos, you'll get though it, but there is one thing that I wish to share before turning in.

Another great issue that I discovered in the last two years is that here in the US, I don't know about the UK, the educational system is no longer teaching right from wrong, black or white, true or false, but is teaching that what matters is the gray areas. I pretty tried right now and I don't remember the name of this concept, but in Amerian schools today, if a kid says that 2+2=5, the student is no longer told that he/she is incorrect. Instead the teach says that the answer is correct, the goal is not to destory the self-esteem of the student, and that the teacher must understand that the student will eventually understand that 2+2=4.

I was born in 1955 and graduated high school in 1973. Therefore I meet a lot of people or converse with a lot of people that were born when I was 20 years old, therefore of a new generation to an age of understanding that I did not go though. This is one reason why I think differently than those 30 and under, because I view issues in black and white, whereas the younger generation views issue only in the gray areas, and gray to the point that there is no black and white, right or wrong, just accept things for whatsover a person says.

Because of this teaching, which I know has destoryed the logical thinking of a generation, is IMO, one of the reasons why paganism is growing in numbers around the western world. Because the "whatsoever floats your boat" method of paganism fits perfectly with the gray area thinking of a new generation.

Off to sleep, talk to you in a few hours.

Odin d'Avalon

Odin, you said you view everything in black and white. This is part of the reason why you can't find your answers. With every answer there is a question. Children think in black and white. If you were to describe the sky among 100 people looking up, you will still get a variety of answers. What you see and interpret is not necessarally what eveyone else interprets what they see.

For example, when a stranger come up to you and says something nasty to you, you would see this as a direct attack, a personal attack. That's black and white. On the other hand, the person who was nasty could have had a bad day and simply was in a foul mood and would direct an attack at anybody. That's where the gray area comes in.

OdinAvalon,

The term is relativism, as opposed to absolutism. Absolutism is something generally associated with Abrahamic faiths- the concept of one true God for example. Relativism allows for the potential that us humans might just have our perceptions influenced by many things such as education, social circumstances, personal experience and the like. Absolutism holds that there are only really absolute answers and that these are knowable. You'd need to look into psychology and philosophy for a more detailed understanding of how these concepts have arisen.

BB

Mike

Odin,


Aftermath of posting

Uprising confrontations?


I wonder if your really funny intrepretation has caused your really hilarious reports of being kicked off other sites left right and centre to really colour your vision of things. You seem to be showing systematic evidence of misunderstanding and an inability to understand DEBATE.

Bertha said

It has been very interesting, and you raise one of the best points of all, that the debate for and against has been very educational. We have known for many years of the huge differences between Paganism in American and the UK, and the re-written histories and past, guillability and blind acceptance is one that seems more common over the pond, although we have some fabulous American intelligent members here

ODINs introductory thread,

I am a little concerned about Odins need for this 'research' given we've been told elsewhere that it's for American legal purposes, and now having re-read it, it seems that he's doing it because he wants to start a new 'ism' (read, religion). Being as a huge majority of the Wiccans paths today are American created that's nothing new. After all Gardner wouldn't recognise much of what is stated as true 'wicca' anymore.


Back to Bertha, we never do stop learning along our path, anyone who stops questioning will be stale or stuck. But if you have your own questions than ask them lass, learning is crucial. Unless you're aiming to start your own religion which then needs an ego and funny claims

And possibly an orange dressing gown and a quest for a virgin or two

Hmm... Berthaism.

I think you might have an idea there.

gypsimoon




That was a great comment in answer to why some people avoid answering the questions posed and instead focus on discreding the questioner. Makes sense





gypsimoon, I've already posted my answer to my question "paganism is whatsoever an individual so desires paganism to be to them. That is the answer that I found. Apart from this there is no other answer. There is individual's views, however all pagan's views are countered by the next pagan standing to their right or left.

To date, I've posted to:

1) the "Core" of paganism? Answer: "diversity" by "whatever floats your boat". (black and white)

2) Paganism just an umbrella term and not a religion? which is true. (black and white)

3) The term Pagan? "which is that no person in history ever called themselves a pagan to mean a person with religion or with religious beliefs". Answer: true. (black and white)

4) Neo-Paganism? (That there never was a religion in history called paganism) Answer: true. (black and white)

5) Is Mythology a Relgion? Answer: no. (black and white)

6) How is a modern religion based on Mythology now a religion? Answer: Because a pagan says so, whatever floats your boat. (black and white)

As a researcher I seek conclusions, answers, reasons, understanding, I seek a final answer in black and white. I conducted a five year research into pagan issues, and asking UKPagans these question was my final stop. And to date UKPagans have posted on this board directly or indirectly the answers listed above. Therefore my research project ended 48 hours ago. I'm done, I have my answers and I have no further need to post another of my 279 questions because they are all answered.

Now if you have another answer to any of the pagan issues listed above, which are the topic of the threads and that the questioner is not the topic of the threads, then I'll be happy to read you added answers. And if your added answers are logical and supported by history, science and the consesus of all pagans the world over (looking for universal answers) then I'll replace my answer(s) found with a better answer that you can give.

Odin d'Avalon

gypsimoon




That was a great comment in answer to why some people avoid answering the questions posed and instead focus on discreding the questioner. Makes sense





gypsimoon, I've already posted my answer to my question "paganism is whatsoever an individual so desires paganism to be to them. That is the answer that I found. Apart from this there is no other answer. There is individual's views, however all pagan's views are countered by the next pagan standing to their right or left.

To date, I've posted to:

1) the "Core" of paganism? Answer: "diversity" by "whatever floats your boat". (black and white)

2) Paganism just an umbrella term and not a religion? which is true. (black and white)

3) The term Pagan? "which is that no person in history ever called themselves a pagan to mean a person with religion or with religious beliefs". Answer: true. (black and white)

4) Neo-Paganism? (That there never was a religion in history called paganism) Answer: true. (black and white)

5) Is Mythology a Relgion? Answer: no. (black and white)

6) How is a modern religion based on Mythology now a religion? Answer: Because a pagan says so, whatever floats your boat. (black and white)

As a researcher I seek conclusions, answers, reasons, understanding, I seek a final answer in black and white. I conducted a five year research into pagan issues, and asking UKPagans these question was my final stop. And to date UKPagans have posted on this board directly or indirectly the answers listed above. Therefore my research project ended 48 hours ago. I'm done, I have my answers and I have no further need to post another of my 279 questions because they are all answered.

Now if you have another answer to any of the pagan issues listed above, which are the topic of the threads and that the questioner is not the topic of the threads, then I'll be happy to read you added answers. And if your added answers are logical and supported by history, science and the consesus of all pagans the world over (looking for universal answers) then I'll replace my answer(s) found with a better answer that you can give.

Odin d'Avalon

cern



Thanks cern, however relativism is not the term that I was looking for.

As to absolutism, that is not the concept of my research, for in searching for answers, I cared not in favor or, or in disfavor of paganism. I remained neutral, without passion or prejudice, soley seeking an answer to my questions based either upon history and science, or where science could not provide an answer, then I sought the universally accepted answers by all pagans asked. And even today, if any pagan should provide a better answer to any of my questions, I would replace my conclusions with a pagan's better answer. Therefore I do not fall into the absolutism category.

Odin d'Avalon

weatherwitch



I posted to deebs I believe it was that I did not join this site to debate, only to post a few questions which I did and will post no further questions, and that I joined to enjoy reading this site, all which I explained in my introduction post in the waiting room when I was asking to re-enter UKPagan after the reconstruction of this site. I stated my intents right up front in the waiting room, no hidden agendas, and in the welcome area you will find posts stating that members where looking forward to reading my questions. To date, the questions have been posted as promised, and now that my research is concluded, there is no reason to post other questions from my research.

I've only been kicked off two sites being a member of over two dozen sites and groups. The reason that I got kicked off two sites was because I asked too many questions, I presented too much of my research project, all questioning various issues of paganism, thereby to pagans viewed as questioning their religion. And so from experience I know how to watch for the signs (dozens of posts directed at my person and not at the questions) and so I know when to stop asking questions.



This is a concern posted in misunderstanding of my posts already made to this issue. I've posted here that some of my research questions were exclusive to U.S. legal issues, and to date I have not posted any of those questions on this UK site.

And I've posted that many of my research questions were world-wide pagan issues, of which I have only addressed 6 of those issues on this site, and have received the same answers here that I've received from U.S. sites. Therefore my research is concluded as to 48 hours ago because UK pagans have the same answers as U.S. pagans, thereby universally accepted.

I was hoping to find better answers in the Motherland. But then I discovered that you folks don't even consider this the UK as the Motherland. I've learned a lot this last week, and I am extremely grateful to every post made, for every post has been an education and a value to the conclusions of my research project.

And if any pagan has a better answer to my 6 questions addressed on this site apart from the conclusions that I've posted, then I'll be happy to replace my universal conclusions for a better universal answer.

Now life goes on.

Odin d'Avalon

Perhaps the questioner should note that a huge percentage of the comments aimed at 'discrediting' the questioner have actually been extremely helpful hints and tips about the differences in approaches to things between the UK and the USA. The UK way of approaching things is very different to the US way, these haven't been attacks in anyway, they have actually been very helpful and would be of great help to the questioner if they had been implimented

I feel that the questioner actually discredits his own abilites to interview and question when he fails to take into account the completely different approaches and attitude we both use and have in comparrison to the USA. This has unfortunately helped to the questioner to actually miss seeing information and answers already given to those questions, with the inability to understand the help offered and given, thus meaning an inability adapt the research into one with an approach more suited to this project.

It also strikes me as odd that within all the questioners years of research, that he only discovered the other day that the UK has never seen itself as the 'motherland' of Paganism. Still, that's research for you

RE: to weatherwitch,

As stated I have my answers, and I've posted my conclusions on this site for all to read. And I've posted that if any pagan has a better universal answer than the answers that I have settled with, that I would be happy to replace my conclusions for a better answer. Until then my answer as discovered remain.

Odin d'Avalon

Me thinks the atlantic communication signals are still very faulty

*sigh* I don't know, you try and help.

Still JC had his disciples, and King Kev his dressing gown ..........

As a second issue (and maybe this needs to be another thread), all these questions seem to lead back to what is paganism. Is a totally new religion based on old myths? Does it mean anything and everything you want it to? Is it the re-emergence of ancient and sacred truths kept secret by a few awaiting the time for it to be common knowledge again?

I think The Secret to paganism, or at least one of the secrets of paganism, is that one really has to listen, to learn to be still, to figure out exactly what it is one believes. For example, Hecate has been with me all my life, but it wasn't until last year that if finally occurred to me that she was everywhere, and was The One - and I had to educate myself as to who she really was, as opposed to the stereotyple, before I became dedicant to her. I think many people, particularly the fluffies, search without when they should be searching within.

Obviously, paganism can't be any spiritual path, otherwise it wouldn't be called paganism, it would be called anything. A person could say "My SUV is sacred and the corporation that made it is a God, and I worship that God, and that is my branch of paganism."



Dryad

Odin wrote:
The majority of what paganism promotes is IMO incorrect.

That explains a lot.

Therefore I say incorrect to history, to what mythology actually means, an allegorical narrative of a hidden meaning of spritual values

So what is correct to history? Remember, history is always written by the victors. Please share with me the hidden spiritual meaning behind Leda and the Swan, for example. Or the myth of Sedna (actually, I can't quite figure out the meaning behind Sedna myself, it seems an odd, violent myth).


Dryad

Hello Dryad



Already posted in the 6 research topics that I've cover by threads created and by replies to other threads in the last week.

Odin d'Avalon

Sorry you took that way but then that is what happens when one assumes I guess.
Everyone has their own truths and from what you have posted here, it seems you have come to your own conclusion or truth. But that doesn't necessarally mean that it is the truth for everyone.

1) the "Core" of paganism? Answer: "diversity" by "whatever floats your boat". (black and white)

That is one aspect of Paganism, not the whole concept.

2) Paganism just an umbrella term and not a religion? which is true. (black and white)

That's the way I understand it. Paganism encompasses many paths

3) The term Pagan? "which is that no person in history ever called themselves a pagan to mean a person with religion or with religious beliefs". Answer: true. (black and white)

I've often called myself a Pagan. Again, although it's not a religion, the term can describe a belief, outside of the main stream without going into detail.

4) Neo-Paganism? (That there never was a religion in history called paganism) Answer: true. (black and white)

Neo-paganism is a mish mash of beliefs taken from ancient cultures.
For example, Wicca can be considered Neo-Paganism because of Gardner, but then again, there are different types of Wicca's.

5) Is Mythology a Relgion? Answer: no. (black and white)

True as far as it goes. Religions incorporate different myths, from Jesus to Allah.

6) How is a modern religion based on Mythology now a religion? Answer: Because a pagan says so, whatever floats your boat. (black and white)

A tad Hubris and condesending What is a modern religion and how does it relate to paganism? Christianity incorporated many Pagan beliefs and penticostals, part of a Christian sect take the bible literally. The consept of the trinity is Celtic and probably older, with the three aspects of the Goddess, Maiden, Mother and Crone. The Christians turned that into the Father, Son and Holy Ghost. So agian, myths may be incorporated into a belief and if that belief is promoted, it can become a religion, as Wicca is in the U.S. as well as the Moonies, which has it's own brand of Christianity. Scientology is a religion, started by a Science Fiction writer. And they have started their own mythology to (according to them) cure addiction by using their methods.

what is being a pagan to me, freedom, peace and better understanding, honesty and friendship. next question

ps why does everything have to be explained, why cant you just be, without the 2+2 and the black and white.
what happens if you cant do maths and you see the world without colour.

gypsimoon,




What this is, is the only universal answer to the question. For any other answer is not shared by all.




I agree, diversity is the only answer shared by all pagans. There is no other universal answer.



Well that is another of my research questions in which I posted several threads on Beliefnet over. RELIGION vs. SPIRITUALITY. I think this one is still the Beliefnet's archives. And as weatherwitch stated so well in I think "the Core of Paganism" a few days back, that "no" paganism is not a religion but a belief system, in which I call a belief system a spirituality (same thing). As to Religion vs. Spirituality, I'll not post my research or questions for as promised I am done.

And so I agree with you, this being the only universal answer shared by all pagans.




I agree, and again diversity, or whatever float a pagan's boat. There is no other universal answer.



And I agree, that the anwer is no, this being the only universal answer to be found.



A tad Hubris and condesending Why? What is condesending is not I, but the data because the data does not support many issues that are simply accepted.

No, Christianity does not incorporate many pagan beliefs, because there were no pagans pre-Christianity, see my thread "THE TERM PAGAN". What Christianity did was to incorporate many aspects of cultures, however, these aspects where never called pagan in history. Therefore Christianity has not a single trace of pagan in it's entire religion, for there were no pagan paths or paganism pre the Roman Catholic Church.

As to Scientology, it is a religion in the U.S. and today in the U.S., you don't have to believe in a God or Goddess to have a religion, for a system based on Philosophy is also now considered a Religion, and it was Scientology that broke the mold in having Philosophy be accepted as a Religion.

Again, my research only sought universal answers supported by data. And so I agree with you on many issues. I enjoyed your posted comments.

Blessings,

Odin d'Avalon

This is getting rather tiring


Pagans didn't exist before christianity?? Sweaty balls to you mate!




We bloomin well did, just because the name wasn't formed and used until later, doesn't mean we weren't there, believing in the essence of nature and our part in all of it.

If you apply your logic elsewhere, you may find that the sun didn't exist before it was called the sun and that the moon suddenly appeared when someone thought of the word 'moon'

As for your time being too important for this - then why did you spend so long writing those last ones? If your time is so valuable, why waste those extra seconds making it blue and red?

I suspect that you spend an immense amount of time on the internet, throwing pebbles in every cyber pond as you go. Maybe it makes you feel like you are educating the masses, but you are not.

And as for that comment you made in your introduction?

What causes you to believe that there isn't one person in the pagan world who hasn't heard of you? I certainly hadn't and it didn't matter how many times you repeated your name, still no bells rang. Or perhaps...No, surely not...Well, maybe...Maybe that's exactly why you're doing this? Visiting as many sites as possible, mentioning your name repeatedly, saying things that any intelligent person would know is going to cause ripples (and no, I am not saying you are not intelligent. I am saying that you are either intelligent and aware of this behaviour or not that intelligent and consequently unaware of the psychology behind your behaviour, the choice is yours) Personally, I don't mind whether you post questions or not, I don't have to read them. I can see if you are the person who has posted the message and I don't have to waste time clicking on it. So, you don't have to get upset and say "I'm not posting anymore"

If you want to start your own religion, perhaps a weekend retreat in the south of france may be more beneficial than countless hours on the internet? Take up t'ai chi chuan and read a book that has nothing to do with research. Spend some time thinking about real life, not the ever-so-neatly-packaged essay version that seems to be your focus. People will never follow you if can't empathise with them. And anyway, why would anyone want to start a new religion? Aren't there enough to choose from?????? All kidding aside...

Take time to enjoy who you are, because one day, you'll be off to that big keyboard in the sky (or the mouse in the ether, whichever you prefer) and you will realise that life is too bloody short to waste analysing it!

It seems that I may have hit the nail on the head...

I think you may just have done exactly that Snow

Everytime I've come on this thread to read it I've just been wondering what the hell has been going on and then had to leave as the headache kicked in.

You made some cracking points there chuck.

Masterfull Snow and so very well put.

You know, in a strange way... I'll miss him. Nahhhh

Well done Snow

good suggestion Stonewitch, *goes to get new hinges* the amount of people storming off is getting a little on the comical side.

I believe he was shown the door rather than slammed it behind him

Out of curiosity, did anyone else try Googling him? It's kinda comical.

no but i sent him an invite to chat on sunday (polar bear and dryad were so pleased)
but alas he didnt get it on time.
and the invite was rather well written and i so wanted to send it to him, but then i am a cow.

I tried googling him, just got a load of french sites. What did you get Fuzi?

i found one that's a banker

*sorry*

but it's true i did!

With his real name and his online name I got a load of links to threads on Beliefnet and Magick.com.au. I'd been expecting him to have a much bigger web presence, what with him being so important and well known. But it looks like he's just put himself about a bit on the boards. Shame, i was kinda hoping he'd have his own website - KFC style

Snow, was that a merchant banker?

I saw on some sites, notably Witchvox and Magick that he was issueing new proclamations and redes to live by. I guess he's in training for that new religion he wants to develop.

Jess

Hmm, might have to pop my head in and have a look.

anyone got a link? googling at work is tricky

That's what I thought. I thought he might have been like an American King Kev. Did you get to see what he was spouting on beliefnet and magick.com.au? I wonder if he's been kicked off there too.



I think I'll have to take a look, they sound like pure gold. Where abouts on Witchvox is he doing this proclaiming?



Yeah but I think you need charisma to manage that one

Had a little rummage on Witchvox, but couldn't find anything by him. I couldn't even find him!

A lot of the Belief.net stuff was 'missing', so maybe he has been given the boot.

http://www.mysticwicks.com/archive/index/t-30402
there's the reference to it, but can't find the original post.

i have found his footprints all over the place but yet only a couple of posts remain and they were unanswered! it's like he's been everywhere but nobody wants to remember it!

He's from Anacortes, Washington, and claims to be the leader of a group founded via Witchvox, but I can find no evidence to back this up.

http://www.magick.com.au/community/article.php?sid=1569
(quote from his post in above link)
"I lead a group of Earth Based Practitioners (Wiccans, Witches, Pagans, Druids, Coven Members, Solitaries and Kindred Spirits) that I befriended as a former poster on WitchVox, which I am proud to say are the Best of the Best posters that I exchanged ideas with, and that now are members of a new community group."

There is an interesting comment at the end, mentioning his joining of ukpagan (albeit a very long time ago) but i'm not sure if he meant another site perhaps?

Do I sense a level of irony in that post? As the author it's my right... hmmm

However

Laugh? I nearly died!

And
This boy really has left footprints everywhere, hasn't he.

Bless his little cotton socks!





As for the rest of him......

d'ya think that from his silence that he's left our charming company, or perhaps he's just lurking and muttering under his breath about how nasty we are for persecuting him?

He also wants to do the same with our 'federal' government but anymore than that I couldn't possibly divulge

He was a member of our old UKPagan site which is odd how he never asked us any of this before there, but maybe he was not yet ready to tackle a site from the 'motherland'

What makes me giggle is that it seems he's so intent on making Paganism the religion its actually not so that he can start his own one ending in 'ism.' Naturally because recognised religions are tax free in the states I just reckon it's coz he want's his own little tax haven in the sun

Ok, Odin has become an outcast (so whilst I hear you all say nothing new there then then ) I mean in terms of the boards. After two public warnings and an utter inability to understand 'english' unless it matched the answers he'd wanted for his research purposes he was banned after Mod discussion by the four of us available.

I'd like to say I miss him but he reminded me of a 1970's record, stuck in the same old groove

Does he have a hope on hell of redeeming himself and coming back to haunt us?

once an outcast always an outcast

Which in the case of the above



to self Behave weatherwitch

Looking back,I really think he is mentally ill or has some kind of mental disorder. His posts are reminiscent of some of the conversations I've had with a housemate that had aspergers. There was a lot she was incapable of understanding (anything outside her little box in fact) and once she'd decided something, there was no changing her mind, her counter arguments would be non-sensical and there would be no comprehension of what you were saying (although she would protest that she'd understood everything). She was highly intelligent in her field (Genetics), it's just that she was incapable of communicating that intelligence and was incapable of debate that challenged her views.

He certainly had an interesting take on research.


For me research is when you have an objective, a hypthothesis and a set of experiments. You then try and actively disprove the hypothesis.
Before starting experimental work you then look at previous work related to what you intend to do, locate relevent literature and use according to its merits an relevence to the topic.

Odin's take on research seems to be make something up, ask a load of questions and not listen to the answers unless it is to confirm what he thinks. I doubt that he has read much around paganism and other beliefs either.

Jess