Jump to content

  • Log in with Facebook Log in with Twitter Log in with OpenID Log In with Google      Sign In   
  • Create Account


How Do You Say Samhain?


38 replies to this topic

#1 Guest : Louisa

  • Guests

Posted 31 October 2010 - 02:31 PM

There seems to be no right or wrong way to pronounce Samhain.

How do you prefer to say it?

Please consider joining the Pound a Month Campaign to help keep UK Pagan Online.

#2 Guest : blodeuwedd

  • Guests

Posted 31 October 2010 - 02:36 PM

Hi Louisa
I was taught to pronounce it Sow Ain,or Sah Wen,thro you try typing Samhain whilst saying Sah Wen in your head :o_wave:

Edited by blodeuwedd, 31 October 2010 - 02:36 PM.


#3 Guest : Louisa

  • Guests

Posted 31 October 2010 - 02:40 PM

:o_wave:

Yes it's tricky. I've been flicking between so-wen, sar-wen even made the mistake of saying say-wen! LOL

#4 Silver wolf

    Very talkative

  • Residents
  • PipPipPip
  • 662 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:pendle, lancashire

Posted 31 October 2010 - 02:47 PM

im a complete numpty and for sopme reason pron ounce it sha man, i think its because the first time i saw it, there was a typo and it has stuck since.

#5 Guest : blodeuwedd

  • Guests

Posted 31 October 2010 - 02:55 PM

:o_wave: mad int it!
All week I have been saying Samhain and having to correct myself.
In the grand scheme of what we believe in I am sure the way we pronounce it makes no odds to those it matters to.

#6 Pomona

    Chief Cat Herder

  • Gatekeepers (lead moderator)
  • 15,855 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Beside the River Forth

Posted 31 October 2010 - 02:59 PM

My Gaelic-speaking friends tell me that it should be pronounced "Sahvin", but despite knowing this, I still persist in pronouncing it "Souwin" :o_wave:
What then? Shall we sit idly down and say
The night hath come, it is no longer day?
Something remains for us to do, or dare;
Even the oldest tree some fruit may bear;
For age is opportunity no less
Than youth itself, though in another dress,
And as the evening twilight fades away
The sky is filled with stars invisible by day.


Henry Longfellow




Join the UKP "£1 a Month" campaign and help keep UKP online



#7 Esk

    A Storm in G Cup

  • Residents
  • PipPipPip
  • 8,337 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:W.Yorkshire

Posted 31 October 2010 - 03:10 PM

"Ha-low-een"
*Contains Strong Language, Fantasy Violence and Mild Peril

Let us think the unthinkable,
Let us do the undoable,
Let us grapple with the ineffable and see if we may not eff it after all!

My blog

Supporting the UKP £1 A Month Campaign

Wyrd Ways Rock Show - the best Rock and Metal podcast on the Net!

#8 Chorlton C. Hardy

    Eh, missus, 'ow do you do that?

  • Residents (missing in action)
  • PipPipPip
  • 2,595 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Lancashire

Posted 31 October 2010 - 03:10 PM

I say samane unless someone gets pissy about having to pronounce it right, then I say halloween.
Learn as much as you can and believe none of it.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

#9 Fred-in-the-Green

    Whistling through the trees...

  • Residents (missing in action)
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,984 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Slightly left of Paranoia

Posted 31 October 2010 - 03:59 PM

"Samhain" is the Irish for "November".

As usual, English people pretend
( a ) they've never heard any Irish
( b ) they don't understand it
( c ) they can't pronounce it.

I used to think it was arrogance, now I'm convinced it's merely laziness. Considering most English people have absolutely no trouble with French, which is the next nation to the right, it's curious they don't recognise the language of the next nation to the left. Whether it be Welsh or Irish.

As a guide, the vowels are much the same as in English but are much shorter. This is going by a Cork pronunciation, where they pronounce the word "Cork" as "Crk!"
So if a word sounds like the English pronunciation of a word, it will have twice as many vowels. That is why written Irish is lousy with vowels.
An "H" after a consonant softens the consonant. You do the same in English, where "th" has a different sound from "t", and "ph" a different sound from "p". An "mh" is somewhere between a "w" and a "v". My own daughter's name is "Niamh" which is pronounced "Neeve". (approximately.)

Anyway, here is the DEFINITIVE pronunciation, from an Irish-speaking website!
Trinity College's Irish Pronunciation!
Just type in "Samhain" and listen to what the nice voice tells you.
:o_wave:

Edited by Fred-in-the-Green, 31 October 2010 - 04:01 PM.

If you don't put a signature, people don't read the last line of your posts.

Hey, look! Purple prose!

#10 Fred-in-the-Green

    Whistling through the trees...

  • Residents (missing in action)
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,984 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Slightly left of Paranoia

Posted 31 October 2010 - 04:09 PM

Oh, and while we're at it, "Damh the Bard" is pronounced "Dave the Bard".
(same-same like "Sawun").
If you don't put a signature, people don't read the last line of your posts.

Hey, look! Purple prose!

#11 Fortuna

    Very talkative

  • Gatekeepers (moderators)
  • 7,621 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Totnes, Devon.

Posted 31 October 2010 - 04:15 PM

Fred-in-the-Green, on Oct 31 2010, 05:59 PM, said:

As usual, English people pretend
( a ) they've never heard any Irish
( b ) they don't understand it
( c ) they can't pronounce it.

I used to think it was arrogance, now I'm convinced it's merely laziness.  Considering most English people have absolutely no trouble with French, which is the next nation to the right, it's curious they don't recognise the language of the next nation to the left.  Whether it be Welsh or Irish.

View Post


It might also be something to do with the fact the English are taught French in schools, but not Welsh or Irish. Or the fact that modern English contains many french words. Or the fact that the celtic languages write phonetically in a very different way to English and French which have a lot more in common. Or maybe because most Irish actually don't speak Irish or that the Welsh are often bilingual and tend to use English in England.

How many Irish have a good working understanding of Icelandic.......... after all that is the next nation to the left. And how many Welsh speak Irish? Gypsies have lived on these islands for four centuries so are the Welsh arrogant or lazy for not understanding Romany?

That said, I liked the site you linked to........ it should clear up the question of Samhaim once and for all.

Mike
Support a fellow Pagan..... check out my jewellery at http://folksy.com/shops/fortunajewellery

#12 Guest : Animystic

  • Guests

Posted 31 October 2010 - 04:15 PM

Fred-in-the-Green, on Oct 31 2010, 04:09 PM, said:

Oh, and while we're at it, "Damh the Bard" is pronounced "Dave the Bard".
(same-same like "Sawun").

View Post

But in this household we make a conscious choice to say "Damn the bard"... because we're childish like that :lol:

#13 Moonsmith

    Πάντα ῥεῖ

  • Residents
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,026 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Midlands UK

Posted 31 October 2010 - 04:26 PM

It all depends where in the Celtic past you come from :lol:

edited to add:

I've been talking to a friend who pronounces it Callum Gaef however you pronounce THAT!

Edited by Moonsmith, 31 October 2010 - 04:28 PM.

The Bear - when being human becomes too too much!

I'd like to know, what this whole show, is all about, before I'm out.
Piet Hein


I've finally arrived exactly where I want to be so why won't all these growth experiences go away & leave me alone?

#14 Dreigiau

    Disobedience is man's original virtue.

  • Residents
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,848 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Chicago, IL USA

Posted 31 October 2010 - 05:38 PM

Fred-in-the-Green, on Oct 31 2010, 10:59 AM, said:

I used to think it was arrogance, now I'm convinced it's merely laziness.  Considering most English people have absolutely no trouble with French, which is the next nation to the right, it's curious they don't recognise the language of the next nation to the left.  Whether it be Welsh or Irish.

View Post

how to the Irish say garage? do they say it like guh-rahzh or gar-ij? :lol:
Posted Image^v^Dreigiau^v^ Posted Image

#15 Guest : spiralfae

  • Guests

Posted 31 October 2010 - 05:50 PM

When I read the word, I read it "Sam-hane."

When I say it, I say "Sow-enn" but it feels wrong, even though it isn't.

Sam-ane feels better even though I know it's not right.

#16 Chorlton C. Hardy

    Eh, missus, 'ow do you do that?

  • Residents (missing in action)
  • PipPipPip
  • 2,595 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Lancashire

Posted 31 October 2010 - 06:24 PM

Halloween!
Halloween!
Halloween!!!
Learn as much as you can and believe none of it.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

#17 Fred-in-the-Green

    Whistling through the trees...

  • Residents (missing in action)
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,984 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Slightly left of Paranoia

Posted 31 October 2010 - 06:42 PM

Dreigiau, on Oct 31 2010, 06:38 PM, said:

Fred-in-the-Green, on Oct 31 2010, 10:59 AM, said:

I used to think it was arrogance, now I'm convinced it's merely laziness.  Considering most English people have absolutely no trouble with French, which is the next nation to the right, it's curious they don't recognise the language of the next nation to the left.  Whether it be Welsh or Irish.

View Post

how to the Irish say garage? do they say it like guh-rahzh or gar-ij? :)

View Post


We say garáiste. :lol:
If you don't put a signature, people don't read the last line of your posts.

Hey, look! Purple prose!

#18 Fred-in-the-Green

    Whistling through the trees...

  • Residents (missing in action)
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,984 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Slightly left of Paranoia

Posted 31 October 2010 - 06:46 PM

Fortuna, on Oct 31 2010, 05:15 PM, said:


It might also be something to do with the fact the English are taught French in schools, but not Welsh or Irish. 

View Post


That simply defers the question: why isn't Irish (or Gaelic) taught in schools? Time was when to be a naturalised Briton you had to speak one of two languages: English or Gaelic. Irish is close enough to Gaelic to pass.

Please excuse. That's a rhetorical question. I know very well why, and I don't want to hijack the thread.
If you don't put a signature, people don't read the last line of your posts.

Hey, look! Purple prose!

#19 Ffred_Clegg

    old scrote

  • Residents
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,385 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Abertawe

Posted 31 October 2010 - 09:51 PM

Moonsmith, on Oct 31 2010, 04:26 PM, said:

I've been talking to a friend who pronounces it Callum Gaef however you pronounce THAT! [/i]

What your friend is saying is Calan Gaeaf

CAL lan GAI av

gwyn eich byd

Ffred
O Benryn wleth hyd Luch Reon
Cymru yn unfryd gerhyd Wrion
Gwret dy Cymry yghymeiri

#20 Ffred_Clegg

    old scrote

  • Residents
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,385 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Abertawe

Posted 31 October 2010 - 09:55 PM

Fortuna, on Oct 31 2010, 04:15 PM, said:

How many Irish have a good working understanding of Icelandic.......... after all that is the next nation to the left.  And how many Welsh speak Irish?  Gypsies

Always thought that the USA was the next nation on the left of Ireland and there's a fair degree of commonality of language involved there.

Did once do an introductory Irish language course through the medium of Welsh so there's a certain number of Welsh Irish speakers (and West Wales farmers used to count to 10 in Irish) but there's not much more communication than that. But then Welsh and Irish are different languages and not mutually intelligible

gwyn eich byd

Ffred
O Benryn wleth hyd Luch Reon
Cymru yn unfryd gerhyd Wrion
Gwret dy Cymry yghymeiri

#21 Fortuna

    Very talkative

  • Gatekeepers (moderators)
  • 7,621 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Totnes, Devon.

Posted 31 October 2010 - 10:15 PM

Ffred_Clegg, on Oct 31 2010, 11:55 PM, said:

Fortuna, on Oct 31 2010, 04:15 PM, said:

How many Irish have a good working understanding of Icelandic.......... after all that is the next nation to the left.  And how many Welsh speak Irish?  Gypsies

Always thought that the USA was the next nation on the left of Ireland and there's a fair degree of commonality of language involved there.

Did once do an introductory Irish language course through the medium of Welsh so there's a certain number of Welsh Irish speakers (and West Wales farmers used to count to 10 in Irish) but there's not much more communication than that. But then Welsh and Irish are different languages and not mutually intelligible

gwyn eich byd

Ffred

View Post


Alright to the left and up a bit
:) :(

Do you mean West Wales as in Western Wales or as in Cumbria? I always found the fact that Cumbrian hill farmers retained a counting system akin to Welsh into the twentieth century fascinating. As I do the fact that Cornish was commonly spoken in much of Devon throughout the middle ages.

I do take your point actually that learning other languages is something most Brits are lazy about (in spite of my English huffiness)........... I know many Welsh are bilingual, but how often do they press this advantage home and learn a third? Or maybe they do....... I'm asking out of curiosity. ;)

I like the sound of both Welsh and Gaelic very much, but in terms of form it feels very alien to me and I come into contact with it rarely.

Mike
Support a fellow Pagan..... check out my jewellery at http://folksy.com/shops/fortunajewellery

#22 Dreigiau

    Disobedience is man's original virtue.

  • Residents
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,848 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Chicago, IL USA

Posted 31 October 2010 - 11:41 PM

Fred-in-the-Green, on Oct 31 2010, 01:42 PM, said:

Dreigiau, on Oct 31 2010, 06:38 PM, said:

Fred-in-the-Green, on Oct 31 2010, 10:59 AM, said:

I used to think it was arrogance, now I'm convinced it's merely laziness.  Considering most English people have absolutely no trouble with French, which is the next nation to the right, it's curious they don't recognise the language of the next nation to the left.  Whether it be Welsh or Irish.

View Post

how to the Irish say garage? do they say it like guh-rahzh or gar-ij? ;)

View Post


We say garáiste. :)

View Post

About 20% might but the rest probably mispronounce it the lazy bastards :(
Posted Image^v^Dreigiau^v^ Posted Image

#23 Dreigiau

    Disobedience is man's original virtue.

  • Residents
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,848 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Chicago, IL USA

Posted 31 October 2010 - 11:43 PM

Ffred_Clegg, on Oct 31 2010, 04:55 PM, said:

Always thought that the USA was the next nation on the left of Ireland and there's a fair degree of commonality of language involved there.

Finally we are left of someone! (no thanks to the lousy teabaggers!) :)  :(

I'm in a silly mood....

Edited by Dreigiau, 31 October 2010 - 11:44 PM.

Posted Image^v^Dreigiau^v^ Posted Image

#24 Esk

    A Storm in G Cup

  • Residents
  • PipPipPip
  • 8,337 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:W.Yorkshire

Posted 01 November 2010 - 08:26 AM

Rightwing Teabaggers? Why do I suspect that's a word that didn't cross the atlantic well?
*Contains Strong Language, Fantasy Violence and Mild Peril

Let us think the unthinkable,
Let us do the undoable,
Let us grapple with the ineffable and see if we may not eff it after all!

My blog

Supporting the UKP £1 A Month Campaign

Wyrd Ways Rock Show - the best Rock and Metal podcast on the Net!

#25 Dreigiau

    Disobedience is man's original virtue.

  • Residents
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,848 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Chicago, IL USA

Posted 01 November 2010 - 08:41 AM

Esk, on Nov 1 2010, 03:26 AM, said:

Rightwing Teabaggers? Why do I suspect that's a word that didn't cross the atlantic well?

View Post


It didn't do very well over here either, it was the cause of much mirth because most people using it to describe the party or members of it had no idea what it meant! That's why it was dropped for the most part unless you are not a tea party member. :D

I couldn't bring myself to explain it to my Dad, I just told him to look it up in the urban dictionary ;)

Edited by Dreigiau, 01 November 2010 - 08:43 AM.

Posted Image^v^Dreigiau^v^ Posted Image

#26 buggirl

    Newbie

  • Residents
  • Pip
  • 66 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:staffordshire

Posted 01 November 2010 - 10:56 AM

Sow-in
Wassail!

#27 Ffred_Clegg

    old scrote

  • Residents
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,385 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Abertawe

Posted 01 November 2010 - 09:50 PM

Esk, on Nov 1 2010, 08:26 AM, said:

Rightwing Teabaggers? Why do I suspect that's a word that didn't cross the atlantic well?

View Post


Is that like the Wenglish phrase "yew bagger off" ?!?

gwyn eich byd

Ffred
O Benryn wleth hyd Luch Reon
Cymru yn unfryd gerhyd Wrion
Gwret dy Cymry yghymeiri

#28 Chorlton C. Hardy

    Eh, missus, 'ow do you do that?

  • Residents (missing in action)
  • PipPipPip
  • 2,595 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Lancashire

Posted 01 November 2010 - 10:43 PM

Ffred_Clegg, on Oct 31 2010, 09:55 PM, said:

Fortuna, on Oct 31 2010, 04:15 PM, said:

How many Irish have a good working understanding of Icelandic.......... after all that is the next nation to the left.  And how many Welsh speak Irish?  Gypsies

Always thought that the USA was the next nation on the left of Ireland

View Post

Doesn't it depend on which way you're facing?
Learn as much as you can and believe none of it.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

#29 Dreigiau

    Disobedience is man's original virtue.

  • Residents
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,848 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Chicago, IL USA

Posted 02 November 2010 - 09:35 AM

Ffred_Clegg, on Nov 1 2010, 04:50 PM, said:

Esk, on Nov 1 2010, 08:26 AM, said:

Rightwing Teabaggers? Why do I suspect that's a word that didn't cross the atlantic well?

View Post


Is that like the Wenglish phrase "yew bagger off" ?!?

gwyn eich byd

Ffred

View Post

nope the modern Tea Party named themselves the after the Boston Tea Party and started calling themselves teabaggers (never mind that tea bags weren't around back in 1773) apparently not realizing the common slang meaning of teabagging which is a man placing his scrotum in another persons mouth and bobbing it up and down like a teabag <_< :(

You can imagine how amusing this was to the rest of us... :D
Posted Image^v^Dreigiau^v^ Posted Image

#30 Ffred_Clegg

    old scrote

  • Residents
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,385 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Abertawe

Posted 02 November 2010 - 09:59 PM

I have a horrible feeling I've just had too much information here...

Congress will never be the same again

And no, not in the Kama Sutra meaning of the word!

gwyn eich byd

Ffred
O Benryn wleth hyd Luch Reon
Cymru yn unfryd gerhyd Wrion
Gwret dy Cymry yghymeiri





1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users